by Guest » Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:27 am
Dear all,
I was in a minor fender-bender car accident earlier this year in January 2008. It was a wet and rainy day, when the car in front of me made a sudden stop, I stepped on my break as soon as I saw the front car stepped the break, however, my car still skidded and bumped the rear bumper of the front car.
The damage was minor, the other car's rear bumper was bent, and the grill and hood of my car was a little bent, there were 2 persons on the other car, the driver and another passenger, they came out of their car and we exchanged insurance information. No one was hurt and no police came.
The other driver and myself both reported to our own insurance carriers, and after investigation by adjusters, I was told that I am 100% at fault, I accept that I am at fault, and my insurance company said that they will take care of the rest, I have full coverage and I am in California.
But, last month when I renewed my auto insurance policy, of course my premium went up because of the accident and the fact that I am at fault, but my auto insurance agent also told me that my insurance company alreay paid for the other party's propery damage, but the other party is not willing to settle with the bodily injury part, the other party is claiming that they have neck and back pain and other sufferings due to the accident.
Today, I received a notice from my claim adjuster saying that the other driver and the other passenger has hired an attorney against me for bodily injury and request that I release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage, what should I do?
Do I have to release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage to the other driver's attorney?
Will my insurance company release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage to the other driver's attorney?
I understand that I am at fault, but it was really a minor accident, I thought the case was closed a few months ago, but now the other party got an attorney against me, will I be in big trouble or get myself into an excess judgement?
I recently purchased a house, I am scared that I will lose my properties in an excess judgement?
I am really upset, can someone please help?
Thanks a lot.
I was in a minor fender-bender car accident earlier this year in January 2008. It was a wet and rainy day, when the car in front of me made a sudden stop, I stepped on my break as soon as I saw the front car stepped the break, however, my car still skidded and bumped the rear bumper of the front car.
The damage was minor, the other car's rear bumper was bent, and the grill and hood of my car was a little bent, there were 2 persons on the other car, the driver and another passenger, they came out of their car and we exchanged insurance information. No one was hurt and no police came.
The other driver and myself both reported to our own insurance carriers, and after investigation by adjusters, I was told that I am 100% at fault, I accept that I am at fault, and my insurance company said that they will take care of the rest, I have full coverage and I am in California.
But, last month when I renewed my auto insurance policy, of course my premium went up because of the accident and the fact that I am at fault, but my auto insurance agent also told me that my insurance company alreay paid for the other party's propery damage, but the other party is not willing to settle with the bodily injury part, the other party is claiming that they have neck and back pain and other sufferings due to the accident.
Today, I received a notice from my claim adjuster saying that the other driver and the other passenger has hired an attorney against me for bodily injury and request that I release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage, what should I do?
Do I have to release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage to the other driver's attorney?
Will my insurance company release the limit of my bodily injury liability coverage to the other driver's attorney?
I understand that I am at fault, but it was really a minor accident, I thought the case was closed a few months ago, but now the other party got an attorney against me, will I be in big trouble or get myself into an excess judgement?
I recently purchased a house, I am scared that I will lose my properties in an excess judgement?
I am really upset, can someone please help?
Thanks a lot.
Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 07:23 am Post Subject:
Dear All,
I did exchange insurance information with other driver, so I think the other driver does have auto insurance, do you know why the other driver is not asking their own insurance company to settle the claim with my insurance company? Why does the other driver have to get an attorney instead of letting their own insurance carrier handle the case, does this mean the other party is uninsured?
Since the other driver got an attorney against me, does it also mean that their own insurance adjuster will not help them?
tcope mentioned that "Injuries as a result of an accident happen all the time... especially in states like CA. That is, the court systems favor the injured party." If the courts in CA favor the injured party, will the courts favor the other driver and their attorney and I will be put in a bad situation?
anonymousadjuster mentioned that "Although California does not have PIP, $5000 medpay limits are standard." Does this mean no matter what kind of accident it is, the insurance will only pay out $5000 medpay?
Thank you.
Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:25 pm Post Subject:
do you know why the other driver is not asking their own insurance company to settle the claim with my insurance company?
Sure, I know, if they use their carrier, they have a claim against their policy they also have to pay the deductible and if they do not have rental they are out that money as well..using the liablity (PD) coverage they have no deductible, no claim on their policy and get a rental...Why does the other driver have to get an attorney instead of letting their own insurance carrier handle the case, does this mean the other party is uninsured
No it doesn't mean that, some people have the common mis-conception that they need an attorney to get more money... :roll:Since the other driver got an attorney against me, does it also mean that their own insurance adjuster will not help them?
kinda yeah, your own carrier will never (offically) help you with a BI claim..anyway...If the courts in CA favor the injured party, will the courts favor the other driver and their attorney and I will be put in a bad situation?
no he didn't mean you'd be put in a bad place...just that the courts apparently are sympathic to folks injured in auto accidents and not so sympathic to carriers..."Although California does not have PIP, $5000 medpay limits are standard." Does this mean no matter what kind of accident it is, the insurance will only pay out $5000 medpay?
No, it doesn't mean that...''IF'' the other party had medpay, they didn't say it was a required coverage, just that most people carry it, (must be cheap in CA, not in my state :roll: )...if they have medpay their policy can pay medical bills only up to the limit...that however doesn't stop a bodily injury claim against your policy....Posted: Tue Sep 02, 2008 01:49 pm Post Subject:
OP, the other party's policy does not address most of their injury loss (i.e. pain and suffering and possibly all of the medical expenses), no one's does. So they are looking to you to address that portion of their claim. Also, if they don't have collision coverage on their policy then their own carrier won't address that portion of the claim either.
The other party obtain an attorney because that is what you do when someone hits you... you've seen the commercials, right. :)
Everyone sues everyone in CA. That is, it's a very litigious state. CA laws do not favor insurance companies so plaintiff attorneys have the upper hand.
Bottom line, I think you can relax. You had insurance at the time and I'm most certain that your insurance company will be able to handle this matter for you. People file injury claims all the time when they are not really hurt (more so in CA). That might be one reason why they obtained the service of an attorney.
Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 06:02 am Post Subject:
Tcope, just curious, what she can expect in the judgement?
Is her asset at risk if the amount of damage exceeds her policy limit?
Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 12:35 pm Post Subject:
Lori mentioned that "Sure, I know, if they use their carrier, they have a claim against their policy they also have to pay the deductible and if they do not have rental they are out that money as well..using the liablity (PD) coverage they have no deductible, no claim on their policy and get a rental..." Sorry, I am a little confused and does not quite understand this part, maybe I did not ask my question right, may I ask my question again? tcope mentioned "You have insurance and your agreement with your carrier is to pay them a premium and they protect your interest when you are liable for property damage or injury to another." so, I have insurance, my insurance carrier should protect my interest, how about the other driver? the other driver has insurance as well, shouldn't the other driver's insurance company protect their interest as well? the other driver's insurance carrier did work with my insurance adjuster and my insurance already paid the other driver for their car damage, why didn't the other driver's insurance carrier continue to work with my insurance adjuster to figure out the amount we have to pay them for bodily injury? why did the other driver have to get an attorney instead of working with their own insurance adjuster? the other party does have auto insurance?
Lori also mentioned that "your own carrier will never (offically) help you with a BI claim..anyway", could you please explain why? isn't your carrier suppose to help you through the claim since you paid the premiums?
Sorry for the many questions, may I also know that is it normal that a claim is switched to different adjusters, since the accident, my insurance company has changed 3 different adjusters for my case?
Thank you for helping.
Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 12:52 pm Post Subject:
so, I have insurance, my insurance carrier should protect my interest, how about the other driver? the other driver has insurance as well, shouldn't the other driver's insurance company protect their interest as well?
When we say 'protect your interest' we mean from a liability/negligence stand point...meaning they are protecting your interest as it pertains to your legal obligation to compensate someone for some act that you are deemed negligent, therefore legally liable to compensate that other party...they are protecting your interest by settling (or attempting to) all claims within your limits therefore protect you from legal action. Or someone coming directly to you for their injury/property damage...the other driver's insurance carrier did work with my insurance adjuster and my insurance already paid the other driver for their car damage, why didn't the other driver's insurance carrier continue to work with my insurance adjuster to figure out the amount we have to pay them for bodily injury?
Ok, then that means they used their collision coverage (maybe) and your company reimbursed them or they subrogated your company for repayment...that doesn't happen with a BI, you don't a coverage on your policy (or anyones except Uninsured motorist or Underinsured motorist which do not pertain to this loss)....that will pay you as an insured (first party) for pain/suffering etc...maybe not even for medical bills and loss of wage, so they cannot settle it with their insured then work it out with your company....why did the other driver have to get an attorney instead of working with their own insurance adjuster?
Honey, some people are just like that...they either, don't trust any insurance company or adjuster, or they think this is the only way to get a fair (or greater) settlement...some people are just that way...they run to an attorney before they go to the doctor...we see it all the time....Lori also mentioned that "your own carrier will never (offically) help you with a BI claim..anyway", could you please explain why? isn't your carrier suppose to help you through the claim since you paid the premiums?
Yes, they are supposed to help you, but they will not be paying out any BI settlement so there will not be a subrogation claim for that...I also said ''offically'' help....some adjusters may offer some suggestions, but most won't...we can't give legal advise, so we have to walk a fine line, most adjusters will not say anything other than explaining the process, ie they won't settle the bi until you have finished treatment, been released from the doc, they won't pay your medical bills as you go, it's all at the end in a lump sum, the vehicle damage and bi are totally separate, etc....just basic info, cannot advise them regarding amount claimed, value of claim etc.....Sorry for the many questions, may I also know that is it normal that a claim is switched to different adjusters, since the accident, my insurance company has changed 3 different adjusters for my case?
Some company's operate that way, might be a physical damage adjuster, a subro rep, and a bi rep, that's not uncommon at all...never apologize for asking questions... :wink:Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 09:49 am Post Subject:
Hi Lori, thanks a lot for your explanations, from reading your reply, I found out that I have a totally wrong concept about how auto insurance works.
Lori explained that "Ok, then that means they used their collision coverage (maybe) and your company reimbursed them or they subrogated your company for repayment...that doesn't happen with a BI, you don't a coverage on your policy (or anyones except Uninsured motorist or Underinsured motorist which do not pertain to this loss)....that will pay you as an insured (first party) for pain/suffering etc...maybe not even for medical bills and loss of wage, so they cannot settle it with their insured then work it out with your company...."
I am still somehow confused with the above procedure in the claim process. It is ok that you could explain again, I am sorry about that.
This is the first accident I have ever had, so there are a lot of things that I don't really understand, my adjusters are really nice and friendly people, but they are too busy to explain everything to me and I am glad to find help here, sorry about my silly questions.
In my situation, my adjuster had me go to a collision center owned by my insurance company to get an car damage estimate, and after the estimate, my adjuster gave me a list of collision repair shops that are affiliated with my insurance company to choose from to get my car fixed, I picked one collision repair shop close to me and went and had my car fixed, I paid the collision repair shop my collision coverage deductible and my insurance company paid the shop the rest of the repair fees.
Is it the same with the other driver? The other driver also reported the accident to their insurance carrier and their adjuster did contact my adjuster to figure out that I am at fault, I know that my insurance had already paid for their car damage, but is it the same process as how my insurance paid for my car repair, say my adjuster also asked the other driver to bring their car for an estimate and then go for repair and then my insurance pays the repair shop that the other driver went for repair?
If so, is it the same process for bodily injury? say the other driver bring in their medical bills to their adjuster and their adjuster contacts with my adjuster and give my adjuster the medical bills and my adjuster pays the other party for their bodily injury? if this is the case, is there still a need for the other driver to get an attorney, their adjuster could help them with the same process that an attorney does?
Lori mentioned before that since I am at fault, so the other party is coming after me to get my liability insurance payment, since they are asking my insurance to pay them, not asking their own insurance for payment, why the other driver's adjuster only will help them to request car damage payment from my insurance company but not bodily injury payment? I think I understand the part that Lori mentioned regarding "that doesn't happen with a BI, you don't a coverage on your policy (or anyones except Uninsured motorist or Underinsured motorist which do not pertain to this loss)....that will pay you as an insured (first party) for pain/suffering etc...maybe not even for medical bills and loss of wage, so they cannot settle it with their insured then work it out with your company...." So, shouldn't the other driver's adjuster help them to get BI payment from my insurance company since the other driver does not have BI coverage on their policy as an insured (first party)? Just like what they did with the car damage?
Sorry about my silly questions, I am kind of confused with the whole process.
Thank you for your patience in helping.
Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:19 am Post Subject:
Is it the same with the other driver? The other driver also reported the accident to their insurance carrier and their adjuster did contact my adjuster to figure out that I am at fault, I know that my insurance had already paid for their car damage, but is it the same process as how my insurance paid for my car repair, say my adjuster also asked the other driver to bring their car for an estimate and then go for repair and then my insurance pays the repair shop that the other driver went for repair
Maybe, or their company repaired the vehicle per their way of doing business then sent your company a bill and your company reimbursed them for what they had paid...or it could have happened exactly as you did, only they didn't have to pay a deductible when it was done, or your company may have just paid them direct for the damage and they didn't even repair it, the bottom line is that your carrier has paid them in full for the repairs to their vehicle one way or the other, and that part of the claim is for all practical purposed done and closed ( the Property Damage portion, meaning the damage to their vehicle)...I need to back up here a minute for the sake of argument...the list of repair facilitys your company gave you were shops that they (your company) would gaurantee the work or repair to your vehicle, you did not have to go to any of those shops and I'm sure they explained that...it was a list of shops that they back the work right?
If so, is it the same process for bodily injury?
no, no, no a thousand times no, it's nothing like the vehicle damage...say the other driver bring in their medical bills to their adjuster and their adjuster contacts with my adjuster and give my adjuster the medical bills and my adjuster pays the other party for their bodily injury
no, not at all if and only ''if'' the other party has some first party coverage like medpay could 'their' carrier pay any medical bills at all...let's assume they did (although it doesn't matter anyway)...they give their carrier the medical bills their carrier pays the bills....that's it with their carrier, they can pay the medical bills up to the medpay limit (remember only if they have that coverage)...med pay is generally not subrogatible..if this is the case, is there still a need for the other driver to get an attorney, their adjuster could help them with the same process that an attorney does?
It's not the case...if they had med pay their adjuster pays the med bills only...that's it...they still have a claim for any non-covered...(and some states you can get paid twice for the same med bills it's called ''double dipping")...their loss of wage, and pain and suffering that they get from your company...only, they cannot get that from their company there is no coverage that allows that..(for the sake of argument, we won't go into um uim pip etc because it does not pertain to this loss)....ok...so your company will not pay them one penny until they have finished all their treatment and are ready to settle once they settle they will pay it all at once in one lump sum...their adjuster cannot EVER represent them in a bi settlement...because (for one reason) they have not paid out any money to recoup or subrogate your company for....Just like what they did with the car damage?
No, they are totally different coverage...BI coverage is a liability coverage, for injurys caused to another person by you...no one can collect under their own liability coverage, you cannot be liable to yourself...in other words bi coverage is ONLY for other people...never ever for the insured....so their company cannot pay them ANYTHING under their own bi coverage, that is why they must come to your policy for it....look at it like this if it were in reverse the other party at fault rather than you...then you might allow your carrier to fix your car, but they could not pay you an injury settlement you must go to the other/at fault party for that...again re: the attorney...it just happens (alot) people think they need one to get moremoney or to protect themselves fromt he mean old adjusters... :roll:Sorry about my silly questions, I am kind of confused with the whole process.
Ins and claims in particular can be very confusing just keep asking until you understand... :wink:Thank you for your patience in helping.
Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 07:39 am Post Subject:
Hi Lori, thanks a lot for your explanations, from reading your reply, I found out that I have a totally wrong concept about how auto insurance works.
Well, Niki it is somewhat a common problem with many of us. We often don't understand what the policy papers explain and don't even bother to find it out unless got hit in the head.
Collision coverage follows the vehicle and covers the losses caused to it. Liability is designed to cover the losses caused to the others and doesn't cover the losses of the policy holder.
When your car has suffered damages in an accident, you can either file the claim with your insurer or can file it under the other party's policy when the other driver was at fault.
The bodily injury claim works differently. The other driver is required to file the claim with your insurer for the medical expenses, wage loss and other financial losses. However, if only the other driver has the Medpay, he can get reimbursement for his medical expenses from his insurer. The insurer then will subrogate your insurance company for the money paid to his customer.
Hope it clarifies a bit :)
Regards,
Juanita
Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:17 pm Post Subject:
I need to back up here a minute for the sake of argument...the list of repair facilitys your company gave you were shops that they (your company) would gaurantee the work or repair to your vehicle, you did not have to go to any of those shops and I'm sure they explained that...it was a list of shops that they back the work right?
Sorry if I am not clear enough, because it was a while ago, I remember my adjuster said that I could go to any repair shop, but if I go to the ones on the list, if anything happens later with the repaired damaged parts on my car, my insurance will take care of it, I hope I am right here?
Lori mentioned
...their adjuster cannot EVER represent them in a bi settlement...because (for one reason) they have not paid out any money to recoup or subrogate your company for....
Sorry I am still confused here, regarding the car damage part, I think the other driver went for an damage estimate, and my adjuster paid them the repair amount on the estimate, probably including rentals, etc., I don't think the other driver's insurance carrier paid them anything on their car damage, they ask my insurance for all of the damage payments, so in this case, the other driver's insurance carrier has nothing to subrogate my insurance for, am I right? If so, why is it not the same with bodily injury payments? The other driver's insurance did not pay out any money for their car damage, but their adjuster still represented them to work with my adjuster for their car damage payment, why can't their adjuster represent them for bodily injury payments as well, isn't it just like the car damage part, the recoup or subrogate process is not involved for both car damage and bodily injury, because their insurance did not pay out anything, they are getting it directly from my insurance liability?
No, they are totally different coverage...BI coverage is a liability coverage, for injurys caused to another person by you...no one can collect under their own liability coverage, you cannot be liable to yourself...in other words bi coverage is ONLY for other people...never ever for the insured....so their company cannot pay them ANYTHING under their own bi coverage, that is why they must come to your policy for it....
Thank you Lori for the above statement, I understand that BI coverage is a liability coverage for other people not for myself, but isn't property damage (car damage) coverage a liability coverage as well? but why is BI liability coverage and property liability coverage processed differently even when subrogation process is not involved? the other driver's adjuster will only help them with the car damage, but not the BI part, thus, the attorney gets involved?
:oops: :oops: :oops: :? sorry about all the questions...............
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