by Guest » Tue Sep 27, 2011 01:28 am
As a single owner LLC, my insurance agent told me that i had to carry workmans comp in the state of nj.i have never had any employees and i just recently found out that i did not have to carry the wc policy,for 13 years i had paid into wc with no claims,im very aggravated and want to know if i can sue him
Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 02:04 am Post Subject:
Anyone can sue anyone for any reason.
Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:51 am Post Subject:
great answer....
Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 06:58 pm Post Subject:
Anyone can sue anyone for any reason.
great answer....
But don't plan on winning anything. As a business owner, you are responsible to know what insurance you should or should not need.
How you could go 13 years without knowing how Workers' Compensation law did or did not apply to your business is beyond me.
And how did you not figure it out when your WC insurance company sent you a Premium Audit form to fill out? WC premiums are based on annual payroll, so without any employees you would not have had any payroll to report. Insurance companies regularly send out such forms to make sure you are not failing to pay the proper premium. If you didn't get one every year, you would have gotten one every other year at the very least.
Go to court? Plan to lose.
Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:51 pm Post Subject:
As a business owner i DO know what i need to carry to be in business in nj.you cant step foot onto a auto dealership car lot without a minimum one million dollar insurance policy(which i carry a 2 million) you also need auto insurance,which i obviously carry.The 3rd which is very vague,in fact my insurance agent told me it was a grey area..ok.. so im not a lawer,or an insurance agent,and unfortunately i took his word for it that i needed it.
As for the w/c audit your completely WRONG, even without employees all llc members are still subject to an audit if they are listed as insured.hence i was insured(even though i didnt need to be)and yes i was audited a few times and had to pay which makes me even more aggravated.why would i carry a lousy wc policy which is only subject to my working hours,and involves a farce of an audit(what a joke)at the end of every year ,when i could of had a more comprehensive disability policy which covers me whenever,is not subject to a yearly audit...why.. ill tell ya why,,cause i couldnt get a straight answer from my agent,and if youve ever tried to get in touch with your state to get get an explanation ,you might as well count on losing a day of work being tangled in a phone tree going from dept to dept
And yes i did contact my lawer and he said yes the w/c laws as well as the rest of the policy should of been explained and the word vague or grey should never be used in any type of contract..the laws are set and it is the selling brokers obligation to let you know if you need to carry certain items in a policy or the option to opt out..which i was never given .This is why hes the broker and im the customer,obviously if i knew his job and terminology too id be a broker.but for you to say i should be responsible to know what ins i need to carry almost sounds like your implying i need to know the laws and coverages that are needed to be carried in a business owners policy,which is completely asinine, i dont sell insurance i didnt go to school to learn it or its laws i relied on an agent to give me the correct answers,(not the answer of yes there is no right answer.so pay up so i get a commission from this sale of something you didnt need)..
The average person reading through a small business owner policy might as well be reading greek.,i dont know any business owner who understands anything in that policy other than the cost of his premiums and the amount of liability coverage .these agents are a joke and should be held liable for their actions.
When i reapplied for new insurance with a different broker last month i asked him if i needed w/c..he said yes,,followed with i believe you do..THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER I WANTED TO HEAR,.i told him he might wanna double check with the state before he tried to sell me something that legally i didnt need.he called me back at the end of the day and said yes,i had the option to opt out of it,which i said i will.
Agent #1 scumbag..agent #2scumbag..with the option to redeem himself..since i, joe Q public had to inform him on how to do his job..
Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 12:15 pm Post Subject:
Here's the answer to your question. Anyone can find this in less than 5 minutes by looking at the NJ Dept of Labor & Workforce Development website, finding the link to the document "An Employer's Guide to Workers' Compensation in New Jersey" http://lwd.state.nj.us/labor/forms_pdfs/wc/pdf/WC-373.pdf and reading:
Partnerships/LLCs – All partnerships and limited liability companies (LLCs) operating in New Jersey must maintain workers’ compensation insurance or be approved for self insurance so long as any one or more individuals, excluding partners or members of the LLC, perform services for the partnership or LLC for prior, current or anticipated financial consideration.
(emphasis added)It goes on to say that financial consideration means:
any remuneration for services and includes cash or other remuneration in lieu of cash such as products, services, shares of or options to buy corporate stock, meals or lodging, etc.
Now I can't tell you if you have or had anyone who falls under that definition or not (which would require carrying the insurance), but this is stuff that I'm sure has always been readily available to you and to your insurance agents in the past 13 years.
There is no gray area here -- it's all in black and white. And it's not an "option". Members of the LLC itself are not covered by Workers' Compensation. If you want that, you have to incorporate and be listed as an employee of the corporation.
Your agents may, in fact, be "scumbags". But you failed to do your own "due diligence" for at least 12 out of the past 13 years. How do you even know that you've had all your other insurances in force in that time? Did you ever call the insurance companies to verify your coverage? Most people never do, and some discover the fact that they never had coverage at the time they need it the most -- when a claim needs to be filed. Until then, who cares?
But, as tcope told you, feel free to sue anyone for anything you'd like. It's your time and money.
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