by saronian » Mon Mar 17, 2008 01:35 am
Hello -
My name is Scott and I'm trying to help my Mother with an insurance claim. She has a pristine 1979 Mercedes-Benz 450 SLC, which was in an accident. It was not her fault, and she has witnesses that support her. Although she is 80+ years old, thankfully she was not injured, other than a bruised knee.
However the car suffered substantial front-end damage and was called a total loss by her insurance. She bought the car new, it has 86,000 miles, and is in excellent condition. Her insurance company originally offered $4,500 and when she protested they offered $7,879.67. So she asked me if I would check to see what the real value of the car is.
It's tricky since there are so few of these on the used car market. The NADA price is between $13,000 average and $17,900 high. The Gold Book of Classic Cars says $12,000 average and $16,000 excellent.
The few used cars I found online were mostly in fair shape and selling for $6-7K. A couple in excellent condition were asking $12-19K but had only 30-50K miles.
The insurance company says they do not use pricing guides, but pay according to the information they receive from CCC Information Services. They took their price, looked around for any used models they could find, and adjusted for mileage. The price they offered is firm and our only alternative is to exercise the Independent Adjuster clause in the insurance contract.
I don't think of the car as collectable, but would like to get $10K or $11K which is only slightly more than the almost 8K offered. I would appreciate any guidance or suggestions on how to proceed. Of if this is most likely a fair offer.
Thanks in advance.
My name is Scott and I'm trying to help my Mother with an insurance claim. She has a pristine 1979 Mercedes-Benz 450 SLC, which was in an accident. It was not her fault, and she has witnesses that support her. Although she is 80+ years old, thankfully she was not injured, other than a bruised knee.
However the car suffered substantial front-end damage and was called a total loss by her insurance. She bought the car new, it has 86,000 miles, and is in excellent condition. Her insurance company originally offered $4,500 and when she protested they offered $7,879.67. So she asked me if I would check to see what the real value of the car is.
It's tricky since there are so few of these on the used car market. The NADA price is between $13,000 average and $17,900 high. The Gold Book of Classic Cars says $12,000 average and $16,000 excellent.
The few used cars I found online were mostly in fair shape and selling for $6-7K. A couple in excellent condition were asking $12-19K but had only 30-50K miles.
The insurance company says they do not use pricing guides, but pay according to the information they receive from CCC Information Services. They took their price, looked around for any used models they could find, and adjusted for mileage. The price they offered is firm and our only alternative is to exercise the Independent Adjuster clause in the insurance contract.
I don't think of the car as collectable, but would like to get $10K or $11K which is only slightly more than the almost 8K offered. I would appreciate any guidance or suggestions on how to proceed. Of if this is most likely a fair offer.
Thanks in advance.
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 05:44 am Post Subject:
Obtain the CCC report and make sure the correct options and miles were used in the valuation. Many times they use incorrect information. Also, you may even want to call the places selling the vehicles listed and confirmed the condition of the vehicles. If they report that the vehicle is in poor condition, report this to the carrier and they can have CCC perform a manual valuation.
Keep in mind that the carrier is not considering retail value.
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 09:00 am Post Subject:
I don't think of the car as collectable, but would like to get $10K or $11K which is only slightly more than the almost 8K offered.
This marginal value worth 2-3K is not too much in connection with a particular like that of yours. But think it from the point of view of the insurer. A marginal increment worth 2k/claim could enhance their annual expense budget by quite a few grands.
If you think you are not being offered a fair deal & could share with me which state She belongs to, I might check out for any further help!
Regards,
Clarion-dSouza
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 09:06 am Post Subject: Thanks!
Hi tcope,
I just have one question in mind:
If the carrier is using CCC info. is it not mandatory that should have been stated under the policy clauses? Or is it that its upto their choice to disclose such info. only when a claim surfaces?
The price they offered is firm and our only alternative is to exercise the Independent Adjuster clause in the insurance contract.
I think it is absolutely important to analyze the policy clauses now if not when the coverage commenced. Thanks!
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:01 am Post Subject:
First it's a third party claim so the insuring contract really doesn't matter, but most policys say something like, we will use any resourse, computer program etc, establish value...
I agree with tcope if they are using CCC then there will be about a million or so pages, there should be toward the end lists of the vehicles they found...I further agree, call them! many times it's just the garbage in garbage out...the report is only as good as the information that was entered on ground level...I've called on these vehicles before to find that they either sound a year ago or the information was incorrect (ie mileage, condition etc)....
I personally think you are being pretty reasonable, based on the info you have I think you are owed 10k on the high side though, somewhere between 9-10k (IMO) ...unless they can find a vehicle in like kind and condition for the near 8k to prove the value, they are wet....however, it is up to you (the vehicle owner) to prove the value of the car (if you disagree) so finding like kind vehicles that actually exist is your best option...have you provided these examples to the adjuster?
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 05:00 pm Post Subject:
That's all good information, thank you very much.
She is in Southern California (Kern County), I am in Northern California.
The two best comps I could find were both 1979 models for $15,500 and $13,900, but these had fewer miles at 33K and 48K, whereas hers has 86K.
Next I found a 1979 with 160K miles for $10,000 and one with 66K miles for $9,995.
The adjuster said I had to find a local car with the same mileage so they could see what the actual selling price was, not the asking price. That's when I figured it was impossible to satisfy their criteria with a car of such low production numbers.
I agree that they believe $7,800 to be a fair price but will go ahead and ask for a copy of their valuation report to see how they arrived at that price.
The frustration is that of the few cars I have found used they are all in much worse condition than her car, so of course they are selling for $8-12,000.
I'll reply once I see the information from their adjuster.
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 05:54 pm Post Subject:
Yup.. many people quote me asking prices but as you mentioned, the selling price is not the same. I always strongly recommend the person review the CCC report. Appraisers quickly fill out loss valuation forms when a vehicle is a total loss. Some of the information is written down incorrectly an many times the info on the vehicle does not fit into nice and neat boxes on the form. Also, with such a limited vehicle, it's possible that CCC needed to stretch their database in finding similar vehicles. If there is a good reason, CCC can have an employee work up a valuation manually to make sure the information they have is accurate.
Posted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 10:37 am Post Subject:
You could also do a market survey for mom's area, call a few 'really good' used car lots, or better yet a benz lot that also has some used vehicles and ask them 'if you had this vehicle on the lot what would you sell it for' another thing, (and i've done this) on ccc reports, call the owners and ask what they sold the vehicle for (not asked---again---most of the time these vehicles have already sold)...don't blame you though for trying to get the most for mom possible..it's very difficult (on everyone) when vehicles like this are totaled to find the fair value...let us know!
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 03:10 am Post Subject:
Hello again -
I received a copy of the CCC Valuescope Market Report from the insurance company. It was amazingly low. They put the value at $4,548 + $604 for excellent condition, making a total of $5,152. They also list two used car dealers in the area who sold the same model recently for $4,195 and $4,900.
So I accept that the insurance's offer of $7,879 is a fair one given the process involved.
I want to thank everyone who replied for making me feel comfortable with the process. This forum is an excellent resource and I've gained a lot of valuable information which is helping me with my current insurance needs.
Scott
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:34 am Post Subject:
Great news Scott....We're glad we could assist you, please don't hesitate to come back often!
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:36 am Post Subject:
This forum is an excellent resource and I've gained a lot of valuable information which is helping me with my current insurance needs.
Kudos to guys like Lori and Tcope!
Keep up the good work.
Thanks,
Lakemen
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