I'd like to get a brief account of the different types of windshield scams that affect the insurance industry.
Total Comments: 9
Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:33 pm Post Subject:
I don't know of any "scams" regarding w/s. What makes you ask this?
Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 07:29 am Post Subject:
Recently, I was going through a blog that focuses on different insurance scams, now I came across your fraud forum that serves the same purpose. Both seemed to be quite realistic and helpful resources. I do realize that there are certain car parts which are vulnerable and set opportunities for con artists. On multiple occasions I've gone through problems and scams concerning windshields and it seemed quite alarming. I just felt the need to know more about it.
Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 10:19 am Post Subject:
You'll often get offers for inflated car repair bills. Such offers seem so good since they'd cover your deductibles. For states wherein it's mandatory to waive the deductible, they'll try this to prove that things are truly free of cost.
Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 09:16 pm Post Subject:
I'm guessing the main "scam" would be replacing the windshield with lower quality glass. I only recently found out that windshields are actually made up of two sheets of glass with a layer in between them, so that cracks in the front pane can be repaired without the crack spreading through to the back pane. Makes the windshield stronger I guess.
God forbid that anyone try to cut costs by using non safety glass on a windscreen - can you imagine the liability claims if that ever happened? It'd be professional suicide from both the repairer and have huge knock on effects for the insurer as well.
Rexhamilton, what scams are you aware of for windshields?
Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 04:18 pm Post Subject:
I've heard of similar situations regarding tires but never windshields. Thanks for the info. I'll be sure and keep this in mind.
Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 03:40 am Post Subject:
I only recently found out that windshields are actually made up of two sheets of glass with a layer in between them, so that cracks in the front pane can be repaired without the crack spreading through to the back pane. Makes the windshield stronger I guess.
Don't exactly know how long you've been around, but safety glass like this has been used in automobiles, trucks, and other vehicles since the 1940s. Thank the WWII-era fledgling plastics industry for the "safety layer" between the two sheets of glass.
The idea is not so much to keep the crack from spreading to the second layer, but to keep the windshield from killing the driver, passenger, and others if it gets hit by some object, like a tiny rock kicked up by the car in front of you. And cracks longer than about 1/2" or so are often not repairable. Some of the GM windshields, with radio antennas embedded in the safety layer, can cost $500-$1000, and the windshield of a Ferrari or other "exotic" can cost well in excess of $2000!
About 20 years ago, as large LCDs were being experimented with, it was once thought they could be used as that safety layer to also provide adjustable window tinting for the vehicle's occupants. Probably never took off because of the cost back then, but the idea had great merit. Maybe the idea will make a resurgence now that LCD are the proverbial "dime a dozen". If you're paying $40,000+ for a Lexus or Acura or Infiniti, what's another $1,000-$2,000 for dial-it-yourself window tinting?
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 03:14 pm Post Subject:
I've paid premiums for insurance for years. We had a flood of black water due to a sewer backup that damaged a lot of property and our insurance company suddenly points our exclusions in our policy that state they won't cover damage due to this. What is the point of having insurance if they don't cover for things that are likely to happen?
They are more than happy to take my money, but when I need them they get really tight. Who reads all those pages of fine print?
We had a flood of black water due to a sewer backup that damaged a lot of property and our insurance company suddenly points our exclusions in our policy that state they won't cover damage due to this.
Can't speak for all policies but usually sewer back up within your own home is not covered. Sewer back up from outside your property is covered.
What is the point of having insurance if they don't cover for things that are likely to happen?
because they charge a premium based on certain, defined things. The policy does not cover sewer backup from within the home as this is really a maintenance issue. At least that is my reasoning... probably not the best. But bottom line is that it's not covered and that sucks.
Who reads all those pages of fine print?
Almost no one... but would reading the policy have changed anything in your situation? I doubt you would have read the policy, realized that it did not cover sewer backup from within the home and then done something about that at the time.
Personally, I don't like the exclusion. I know why it's there... as it considers someone not maintaining their drain pipes within the home and this causing them to back up. But in reality, things like this happen to the average person.
Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 03:25 am Post Subject:
They are more than happy to take my money, but when I need them they get really tight. Who reads all those pages of fine print?
You might feel this way, and at the same time, I think some insurance company executives often wonder, "Why are people happy to give us money and not know what it does (or doesn't do) for them?"
Perhaps you'll learn to read ALL of your insurance policies now. You might discover that you're paying for other things that are not covered. At least knowing what is and isn't covered will prevent you from being too upset when the claim is not paid the next time.
When it comes to sewer backup, it's not usually an "instantaneous" event. Not unless the two year old flushes a whole box of Pampers/Huggies/Depends down the toilet at one time -- and you probably would not expect the insurance company to pay for that. Usually, drains start running slower, and/or water starts coming up in other sinks/tubs, then recedes. Clues that something is amiss, and it might be a good idea to call a real plumber because the four gallons of Liquid Plum'r so far don't seem to do anything to help the situation.
No insurance policy covers EVERY POSSIBLE LOSS. And the ones that are most likely to be a maintenance issue rather than a sudden, unexpected event, are the ones least likely to be covered (said another way, most likely to be excluded). Perhaps the next time the sewer line backs up, a water pipe in the vicinity will also burst -- or a fire will break out. Those are both covered losses.
Roofs are another sore point for some policyowners. How many people have their roofs inspected every few years? But when the big leak occurs, they think the insurance company is going to cover the loss for their lack of maintenance. Doesn't happen.
Mold used to be covered, because the claims did not occur frequently. That was when most homes were built with actual plaster walls -- nothing for the mold to really feed on other than the paint. Along comes drywall with its paper cover, and a little moisture allows the mold to run wild. So today, a person could use fiberglass coated drywall to avoid the potential for mold. But insurance companies no longer cover mold claims.
Floods and fires and earthquakes and other potential catastrophic losses have led to government risk pools (NFIP, FAIR Plan, California Earthquake Authority, Federal Crop Insurance, etc), but these are not the be all and end all of coverage -- deductibles are higher, costs are higher, claims are fewer.
Should an insurance company cover sewer backup as Grinshan describes? Perhaps. If it meant having to pay a plumber to clear the pipes at least once every two years, would you be willing to pay the $200-$400 or more that service costs? If not, then accept the fact that it's not going to be covered.
Insurance is an "aleatory" contract -- there will be unequal giving and receiving -- pay a lot of premiums, never have a covered loss . . . or pay a small amount of premium and have a huge loss. Both occur. Most insurance is also provided in a contract of "adhesion" -- a take it or leave it proposition. If you don't like what they exclude, look for something else somewhere else, or ask for an endorsement or rider to cover it . . . and pay what they ask for the privilege.
Too many people have no one to "blame" but themselves for not reading and/or understanding their insurance policies. The same is true in car loans, home loans, and other installment contracts. People want, and they don't care what is in the "fine print" they chose not to read . . . until it's too late.
Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:33 pm Post Subject:
I don't know of any "scams" regarding w/s. What makes you ask this?
Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 07:29 am Post Subject:
Recently, I was going through a blog that focuses on different insurance scams, now I came across your fraud forum that serves the same purpose. Both seemed to be quite realistic and helpful resources. I do realize that there are certain car parts which are vulnerable and set opportunities for con artists. On multiple occasions I've gone through problems and scams concerning windshields and it seemed quite alarming. I just felt the need to know more about it.
Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2009 10:19 am Post Subject:
You'll often get offers for inflated car repair bills. Such offers seem so good since they'd cover your deductibles. For states wherein it's mandatory to waive the deductible, they'll try this to prove that things are truly free of cost.
Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 09:16 pm Post Subject:
I'm guessing the main "scam" would be replacing the windshield with lower quality glass. I only recently found out that windshields are actually made up of two sheets of glass with a layer in between them, so that cracks in the front pane can be repaired without the crack spreading through to the back pane. Makes the windshield stronger I guess.
God forbid that anyone try to cut costs by using non safety glass on a windscreen - can you imagine the liability claims if that ever happened? It'd be professional suicide from both the repairer and have huge knock on effects for the insurer as well.
Rexhamilton, what scams are you aware of for windshields?
Posted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 04:18 pm Post Subject:
I've heard of similar situations regarding tires but never windshields. Thanks for the info. I'll be sure and keep this in mind.
Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 03:40 am Post Subject:
I only recently found out that windshields are actually made up of two sheets of glass with a layer in between them, so that cracks in the front pane can be repaired without the crack spreading through to the back pane. Makes the windshield stronger I guess.
Don't exactly know how long you've been around, but safety glass like this has been used in automobiles, trucks, and other vehicles since the 1940s. Thank the WWII-era fledgling plastics industry for the "safety layer" between the two sheets of glass.
The idea is not so much to keep the crack from spreading to the second layer, but to keep the windshield from killing the driver, passenger, and others if it gets hit by some object, like a tiny rock kicked up by the car in front of you. And cracks longer than about 1/2" or so are often not repairable. Some of the GM windshields, with radio antennas embedded in the safety layer, can cost $500-$1000, and the windshield of a Ferrari or other "exotic" can cost well in excess of $2000!
About 20 years ago, as large LCDs were being experimented with, it was once thought they could be used as that safety layer to also provide adjustable window tinting for the vehicle's occupants. Probably never took off because of the cost back then, but the idea had great merit. Maybe the idea will make a resurgence now that LCD are the proverbial "dime a dozen". If you're paying $40,000+ for a Lexus or Acura or Infiniti, what's another $1,000-$2,000 for dial-it-yourself window tinting?
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 03:14 pm Post Subject:
I've paid premiums for insurance for years. We had a flood of black water due to a sewer backup that damaged a lot of property and our insurance company suddenly points our exclusions in our policy that state they won't cover damage due to this. What is the point of having insurance if they don't cover for things that are likely to happen?
They are more than happy to take my money, but when I need them they get really tight. Who reads all those pages of fine print?
___________
Insurance reviews
Posted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 05:06 pm Post Subject:
[Why can't people start new threads :roll:]
We had a flood of black water due to a sewer backup that damaged a lot of property and our insurance company suddenly points our exclusions in our policy that state they won't cover damage due to this.
Can't speak for all policies but usually sewer back up within your own home is not covered. Sewer back up from outside your property is covered.What is the point of having insurance if they don't cover for things that are likely to happen?
because they charge a premium based on certain, defined things. The policy does not cover sewer backup from within the home as this is really a maintenance issue. At least that is my reasoning... probably not the best. But bottom line is that it's not covered and that sucks.Who reads all those pages of fine print?
Almost no one... but would reading the policy have changed anything in your situation? I doubt you would have read the policy, realized that it did not cover sewer backup from within the home and then done something about that at the time.Personally, I don't like the exclusion. I know why it's there... as it considers someone not maintaining their drain pipes within the home and this causing them to back up. But in reality, things like this happen to the average person.
Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 03:25 am Post Subject:
They are more than happy to take my money, but when I need them they get really tight. Who reads all those pages of fine print?
You might feel this way, and at the same time, I think some insurance company executives often wonder, "Why are people happy to give us money and not know what it does (or doesn't do) for them?"
Perhaps you'll learn to read ALL of your insurance policies now. You might discover that you're paying for other things that are not covered. At least knowing what is and isn't covered will prevent you from being too upset when the claim is not paid the next time.
When it comes to sewer backup, it's not usually an "instantaneous" event. Not unless the two year old flushes a whole box of Pampers/Huggies/Depends down the toilet at one time -- and you probably would not expect the insurance company to pay for that. Usually, drains start running slower, and/or water starts coming up in other sinks/tubs, then recedes. Clues that something is amiss, and it might be a good idea to call a real plumber because the four gallons of Liquid Plum'r so far don't seem to do anything to help the situation.
No insurance policy covers EVERY POSSIBLE LOSS. And the ones that are most likely to be a maintenance issue rather than a sudden, unexpected event, are the ones least likely to be covered (said another way, most likely to be excluded). Perhaps the next time the sewer line backs up, a water pipe in the vicinity will also burst -- or a fire will break out. Those are both covered losses.
Roofs are another sore point for some policyowners. How many people have their roofs inspected every few years? But when the big leak occurs, they think the insurance company is going to cover the loss for their lack of maintenance. Doesn't happen.
Mold used to be covered, because the claims did not occur frequently. That was when most homes were built with actual plaster walls -- nothing for the mold to really feed on other than the paint. Along comes drywall with its paper cover, and a little moisture allows the mold to run wild. So today, a person could use fiberglass coated drywall to avoid the potential for mold. But insurance companies no longer cover mold claims.
Floods and fires and earthquakes and other potential catastrophic losses have led to government risk pools (NFIP, FAIR Plan, California Earthquake Authority, Federal Crop Insurance, etc), but these are not the be all and end all of coverage -- deductibles are higher, costs are higher, claims are fewer.
Should an insurance company cover sewer backup as Grinshan describes? Perhaps. If it meant having to pay a plumber to clear the pipes at least once every two years, would you be willing to pay the $200-$400 or more that service costs? If not, then accept the fact that it's not going to be covered.
Insurance is an "aleatory" contract -- there will be unequal giving and receiving -- pay a lot of premiums, never have a covered loss . . . or pay a small amount of premium and have a huge loss. Both occur. Most insurance is also provided in a contract of "adhesion" -- a take it or leave it proposition. If you don't like what they exclude, look for something else somewhere else, or ask for an endorsement or rider to cover it . . . and pay what they ask for the privilege.
Too many people have no one to "blame" but themselves for not reading and/or understanding their insurance policies. The same is true in car loans, home loans, and other installment contracts. People want, and they don't care what is in the "fine print" they chose not to read . . . until it's too late.
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