by Grace Ouattara » Thu Sep 25, 2008 03:22 pm
My father recently passed away, he named is ex-step son, ex-wife's son, as the beneficiary on his policy and never changed it. Can my mother contest this. He divorced this woman over 20 years ago. Policy was written when he was married to the ex-wife.
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 03:42 pm Post Subject:
You really need to talk to the issuer of the policy. I'm not trying to be vague..but they are the only ones who can help you I think.
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 04:09 pm Post Subject:
I am sorry for your loss.
I am almost certain that this is not contestable. He had over 20 years to change the beneficiary but chose not to get around to it. Why? I am not trying to be disrespectful or hurtful but maybe he really wanted it to go to this person for reasons you'll never know.
Anyhow, even if he just forgot, it will be a tough one to win. I'd think impossible but I am not a lawyer and I don't know all the details
Kind Regards and best of luck
Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 08:36 pm Post Subject:
It really depends on the policy and the state...was this a private policy or one he had a work? Absolutely contact the insurer and let them know you wish to contest the beneficary...won't hurt...might be sunk but I'd certainly try....also might contact your states dept of ins...they all have web sites as well as consumer assistance...check into the laws and regulations governing your state..I'm so very sorry.
PS has Dad's funeral been paid yet? What are the odds of former wife agreeing to use the ins to pay the bill?
Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:01 am Post Subject:
These posts pop up all the time about somebody who died and somebody who is NOT getting the money wants to find out if they can somehow get the money because they don't think it's right that the person named in the CONTRACT by the person who OWNED the CONTRACT should get the money because they want the money.
Life insurance death benefits with named beneficairies are almost always impossible to contest. The beneficiary is under no obligation to pay for any of the deceased person's debts.
If the deceased person was concerned about estate liquidity they would have named their estate as beneficiary.
The beneficiary is the PERSON for whose benefit the money is paid.
It's for the BENEFIT of that person and no other person.
This is life insurance 101.
This thought process of because 20 years has past this couldn't be the deceased person's desire is absurd. People know who their benfeciaries are, after all, they have been paying a premium with their money.
Now if you can prove, fraud, duress, undue influence or mental incompetency at the time the beneficiary designation was made you may have case.
Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:38 am Post Subject:
I agree with you Gary in theory...and also that the 'wantabe' beneficary is probably out of luck..
However we are (for the most part) talking about men that haven't a clue nor desire to know much about life ins...I know ALOT of men that never give it a thought...it comes out of the paycheck..and it just doesn't even 'occur' to them they need to change it (the bene) after a life change....happens all the time....some times it's hard for those of us in the 'biz' to remember that everyone doesn't live and breath ins...nor do they care too (i wouldn't either if it didn't pay the bills most likely it's
d-u-l-l)..so I really don't think it's absurd most of the time at all...it is however in most situations futile.
Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:27 pm Post Subject:
Lori, I agree men are the worst when it comes to Estate Planning issues.
If someone was to offer me 10,000 men leads for estate planning vs 100 women leads for estate planning I'd take the 100 women.
Men suffer from egotistical apathetic ignorance on the subject of death and the mess they leave behind.
However, there are other very educated men known as probate practice attorneys who make tens of thousands of dollars off these egotistical apathetic ignorant male buffoons at the expense of their adult children.
That's okay.
The standard male line is, "When I'm dead, I don't care."
I love to point out to these egotistical apatheticly ignorant male buffoons that, THAT attitude is just what the probate practice attorneys are counting on and they thank YOU for naming them as a MINIMUM 3% (Florida) beneficiary on the inventory value of your probate estate.
As Eleanor Roosevelt once said, "Nobody can make a fool out of you without your permission."
:P Of course Joe Biden would say, Lincoln said that after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor during Vietnam. :P
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 10:35 am Post Subject:
The standard male line is, "When I'm dead, I don't care."
That's fine for those you speak too...the problem is more times than not, nice middle class blue collar guy...buys a policy thru his work, gets divorced remarried, couple of times maybe...maybe one wife talks him into increasing a limit...he dies many kids later...nothing got changed, because the wife that knew about it is no longer in the picture....she's forgot about it too...IMO there should be some sort of monitor on these types of policys...maybe he has to fill out a new form every five years or something..most of these men would be aghast, and very broken hearted if they had realized what their lack of action did, or that they even had to change anything...(in their graves) if they realized that exwife or ex wife's kids ended up with their 50k policy...I seriously doubt there is any malice on either side...just great hardworking guys "doe-tee-doe-doeing" thru life without giving it a thought...it's a shame...truly...I love to point out to these egotistical apatheticly ignorant male buffoons that, THAT attitude is just what the probate practice attorneys are counting on and they thank YOU for naming them as a MINIMUM 3% (Florida) beneficiary on the inventory value of your probate estate.
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:56 am Post Subject:
Lori, it is a rare event that a person with life insurance doesn't know who their beneficiaries are.
RARE.
What you are describing is the RARE event that rarely happens and to prevent this rare event we need a new law or regulation or ANOTHER piece of useless paper to hold an ADULT PERSON'S HAND as they, as you say are, "doe-tee-doe-doeing" thru life without giving it a thought"
How do you know after a person is dead who they wanted as beneficairy?
How do you know after they are dead they weren't still in love with their ex-wife and wanted her to have the money maybe just to spite the new wife who turned out to be worse than the first?
How do you know after they are dead they weren't still very fond of their STEP-SON from a previous marriage and wanted to provide for him?
How do you know after the they are dead they weren't fed up with perhaps an irresponsible biological daughter to the point they wouldn't give her the time of day.
Someone like Casey Anthony in Floirda. Her parents may very well NEVER leave her a dime of their life insurance for whatever she did to or with their granddaughter.
HOW DO YOU KNOW?
YOU DON'T.
So all we have left is the legal documentation SIGNED by the DEAD PERSON that says give THIS MONEY to THIS PERSON when I die.
What you are suggesting is that government require people to reaffirm their beneficiary designations periodically so as to make sure we really, really, really know what their intentions are because they are too stupid or lazy to make the changes on their own.
Further, EVEN if a person is successful in getting a judge to throw out the beneficairy designation for whatever reason that just throws the proceeds into probate court where NOBODY gets the money for about three years after the court costs, attorney fees, expenses, probate bond, creditor claims and all "other" interested parties who come creeping out of the woodwork are paid FIRST.
The cure is worse than the EXTREMELY RARE disease.
In my humble opinion.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 11:12 am Post Subject:
What you are describing is the RARE event that rarely happens and to prevent this rare event we need a new law or regulation or ANOTHER piece of useless paper to hold an ADULT PERSON'S HAND as they, as you say are, "doe-tee-doe-doeing" thru life without giving it a thought"
Well Gary if it's rare, I've personally seen it happen about ten tiems...I'm not talking about any law or regulation, I'm mainly talking about the policys that many people take out with their employer and die while that policy is in effect....those are the ones (IMO) that people forget all about...the one that never ever see a bill for it comes out pre tax and they simple forget about it....If you asked these men (mostly) who is the bene. on your life policy...(re: the type I am talking about)...they'd more than likely say, 'well oh crap it might still be my ex wife's son!'....chances are good they haven't even thought about that policy in 20 years or better...(reminds me I need to talk with a particular brother in law, he could have his screwed up too :roll: )...You are correct in most cases you don't, but in many you do....or you can make a pretty good assumption based on the family history which or course isn't worth squat....in the same vein though you don't know that they didn't flat forget all about it...that's my point....
What you are suggesting is that government require people to reaffirm their beneficiary designations periodically so as to make sure we really, really, really know what their intentions are because they are too stupid or lazy to make the changes on their own.
No I'm not I'm suggesting that a form be sent BY THE INS COMPANY that wrote the policy and COLLECTS the premiums...send out a letter minimally every five years...that's what I'm suggesting..."I" never called anyone stupid or lazy...in fact think I portrayed the 'type' I'm talking about quite the opposite...you don't have to be stupid nor lazy to completely forget about these things....EVERYONE doesn't live and breath estate planning or life insurance Gary, surely you agree...The cure is worse than the EXTREMELY RARE disease.
I don't know how rare it is...check the number or posts on this very topic...now granted some 'could be' vultures...of course...Let me ask you something....as a service to your clients...when someone divorces etc...maybe you see it in the paper do you call up a client, or send a note, 'sorry about the divorce just wanted to bring to your attention you still have your ex wife as your beneficary, do we need to change that?" (and of course perhaps sell him something else at the same time..)
As I said I'm talking mostly about the corp.policys that many people just flat forget about....that cost them about 2 bucks a month.
Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 08:39 pm Post Subject: benefits
my sister and brother in law divorced she kept the policy paid the premiums and he never changed the beneficiary because he wanted it to be her she remarried 25 yrs past he died insurance co does not want to pay. this is all in missouri how can this be. she even did all the funeral arrangements
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