by cbluezzz » Thu Feb 12, 2009 02:15 am
my father whom my sister and i have been estranged from for many years passed away in august....we found out in november from a letter we recived from his life insurance company.....we are named as secondary benifaciers the primary benifcary pased 3 months befor he did. his sister whom we did not know exsisted is contesting the pay out of the policy, can she do this? what are her chances at wining. she was not listed at all
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 03:28 am Post Subject:
his sister whom we did not know exsisted is contesting the pay out of the policy, can she do this? what are her chances at wining. she was not listed at all
She has exactly two chances of successfully challenging the life insurance beneficiary designation.
#1) Slim
and
#2) None.
She would have to have a "legal" reason for a judge to throw out the beneficiary designation that your Father made of his own free will.
Further, even if your Father's sister was successful those proceeds would then be paid pursuant to the probate code of your state and YOU and your sister would be your Father's lineal descendants anyway and first in line to receive the proceeds.
Your Aunt would have to prove, fraud, undue influence, duress or mental incompetency at the time your Father made his beneficiary designations.
:? Now who would be committing FRAUD, UNDUE INFLUENCE or DURESS (holding a gun to Pops head) forcing him to name them as the contingent beneficiary???!!???!! :shock:
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 03:50 am Post Subject: life ins
thanks so much....I didnt think she did but ya never know....she seems to think she can take it all....we have offered to pay the expenses from the service and the cremation...which i think is more than fair.
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 10:31 am Post Subject:
The insurance laws are pretty clear in this regard, whoever is the beneficiary of the life policy would get the benefits. Gary is absolutely correct that to get the judgement in her favor your aunt has to prove undue influence over the policy holder during the process of listing beneficiaries.
Moreover, if she indeed wants to challenge the beneficiary status she has to inform the insurer about it and stop the payment of the benefits to you. Have you heard anything of that sort yet?
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:18 am Post Subject:
Your welcome cbluezzz.
Don't be too fast to pay your Father's left over bills. Those would be paid out of his Estate, if any. You are NOT legally responsible to pay those bills, but I understand the moral issue.
For more information tune into The Financial Power Hour streaming live on www . whnz . com beginning Thursday, February 19th 2009 @ 1:00 PM.
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:57 am Post Subject: insurance law
yes the insurance company told me and my sisiter that she filed a stop payment but that it was inactive because they were still trying to locate my sister now that they have found her they will send her a letter and she has 30 days to do something about it if on the 31st day she has done nothing they will issue our checks but if she tries to do something about it that it will have to go to court. this was a policy that my father set up about 20 years ago. he also had nothing to do with his sister untill three months befor he died when he returned to fl where she lives.
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 12:22 pm Post Subject:
cbluezzz wrote:
he also had nothing to do with his sister untill three months befor he died when he returned to fl where she lives.
Thanks for the additional state specific information, RE: Florida.
Your Aunt has ZERO chance of prevailing under Florida law.
Florida Statute 222.13
222.13 Life insurance policies; disposition of proceeds.--
(1) Whenever any person residing in the state shall die leaving insurance on his or her life, the said insurance shall inure exclusively to the benefit of the person for whose use and benefit such insurance is designated in the policy, and the proceeds thereof shall be exempt from the claims of creditors of the insured unless the insurance policy or a valid assignment thereof provides otherwise.
Notwithstanding the foregoing, whenever the insurance, by designation or otherwise, is payable to the insured or to the insured's estate or to his or her executors, administrators, or assigns, the insurance proceeds shall become a part of the insured's estate for all purposes and shall be administered by the personal representative of the estate of the insured in accordance with the probate laws of the state in like manner as other assets of the insured's estate.
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 03:08 pm Post Subject:
Gary, you said the poster needed to hold off in paying the creamation and funeral bills. Doesn't financial arrangements get set up beofre the services take place? How is a funeral home gaurenteed their money if no one signs on as legaly responsible?
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:26 pm Post Subject:
Doesn't financial arrangements get set up beofre the services take place? How is a funeral home gaurenteed their money if no one signs on as legaly responsible?
Yes, usually.
Funeral homes get to operate, charge fees and have people sign agreements when they are under duress.
The final expense bill is paid out of the Estate of the deceased person and I would do my best to have the funeral home wait on their distribution if possible.
I'm not saying this is possible or practical but people are at an extreme disadvantage when death occurs and they have to make decisions based on the emotion of the moment.
Let me tell you a true story.
A client of mine's Mother had died. She had already made all her arrangements to be cremated. This wasn't an issued with any family member. They EVEN told the funeral Mom would be cremated.
Do you know when the body arrived at the funeral home they embalmed the body BEFORE they cremated the body then charged the family another $1,500 for embalming.
Most people would pay that bill rather than fight the in-your-face-FRAUD.
So my point is..... Watch your wallet when under stress and duress and especially if involved in the financial arrangements of the disposition of a deceased person's remains.
Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 08:52 pm Post Subject:
OP.....everyone here is correct there is virtually no chance of your aunt winning this case. The benefit will pass to you outside of your fathers estate and therefor completely avoid probate. I would make one additional recommendation. I am not sure how much your fathers estate is worth (no including the death benefit) but because you know there are potential relatives that may be gunning for his money in general....you may want to take his estate through probate (weather or not it is reqired). Why would you do this????? If the estate never goes through probate then it is open to be contested for a certain number of year (varries by state). Once the estate is probated it is done! no one elases can contest the will or try to get the money. So it may be worth probating the estate just to make sure it is split correctly and you will never need to worry about it again. This is sometimes how we handle vary large estates. We recommend that the client leaves a couple hundred thousand dollars out of there trust so that there will be something to probate. That way there will not be a question in the future....Think Anna Nicole Smith... :)
Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 07:43 am Post Subject:
Hey Marpol, I thought that all the estates need to undergo the probate court for proper distribution of the assets. Can you tell me more about the threshold for probating the estate? Also, does it depend upon the discretion of the heir to probate or not the estate of the deceased?
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