I drive a company vehicle. I recently had tools stolen from the vehicle. does the insurance policy cover this.
Total Comments: 11
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 01:31 am Post Subject: insurance
If the tools were in the vehicle, I believe your Insurance DOES cover them. Also..(would like to ask)..you said you were driving a company vehicle? Do you have Business Insurance?
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 12:00 pm Post Subject:
If the tools were your personal property, you would have a better chance of collecting on your homeowner's policy than on an auto policy (subject to the limit of coverage and any deductible). I assume when you state "I drive a company vehicle" that you are not the owner of the company.
Your company's auto coverage probably does not include coverage for your tools, nor would their commercial theft coverage apply to your tools in most cases. If the tools belong to the company, then they would need some form of theft coverage on the tools.
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 12:06 pm Post Subject: insurance
Why wouldn't the tools be covered under an auto policy, if they were in a vehicle, when they were stolen?
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 12:57 am Post Subject:
Well, let's examine the purpose of auto insurance. There are two basic types of losses that can result from the ownership and operation of a motor vehicle: injuries to others or their property, known as "liability" losses (must be due to the insured's negligence, payments are made to third parties). And there can be physical damage losses to the insured vehicle.
In addition to this, an auto policy can be extended to cover injuries to occupants of the vehicle -- "medical payments" -- or to the insured and resident members of their household (but not roommates or temporary guests/visitors) as a pedestrian if struck by an automobile.
The physical damage losses are categorized into collision and other-than-collision, sometimes known as "comprehensive". It's the other-than-collision section that covers additional vehicle-related losses such as theft, and burglary of the auto resulting in damage to doors, windows, and theft of permanently attached items such as "sound reproduction equipment" (stereo radios, CD players, DVD players).
Losses can also include those caused by or suffered by certain towed items (trailers, boats, other vehicles).
But the auto policy is not a "property" policy like a homeowner's policy. "Contents" (personal property not attached to the vehicle) are not normally covered by auto policies. But most personal property is normally covered under a homeowner's or tenant's policy anywhere in the world to a limited extent (depends on the type of property).
A common scenario that we teach to illustrate the concept is this: John and Cindy drive to the electronics store and purchase a 52" big screen TV. They load it into their SUV and head home to watch the big game. But in their excitement, John is a bit inattentive, fails to stop for a red light, and collides with an oncoming vehicle that has turned left into his path.
John is determined to be at-fault for the collision. In addition to his vehicle's damage, the big screen TV is also damaged beyond repair. John suffers minor injuries and Cindy receives a broken arm while shielding her face from the passenger air bag.
How will the damages be paid?
(1) John's liability coverage pays for the damages to the other vehicle and to any occupants of that vehicle, up to his policy limits.
(2) John's collision coverage pays for the damages to his vehicle, less the deductible.
(3) John's policy's Medical Payments coverage pays for his injuries and for Cindy's injuries up to the individual limits per person (commonly $1000 to $5000). This coverage is "excess" if John and Cindy also have health insurance (their medical insurance pays first. So let's say they have a $500 emergency room copay on their PPO policy, the auto policy medical payments will cover that out of pocket expense).
(4) There is no part of the auto policy that covers the big screen TV -- although it can be considered "sound reproduction equipment" -- because it is not "permanently attached".
(5) However, John's homeowner's policy covers newly acquired property, and will pay the replacement cost of the TV, less the deductible, same as if his dog and cat get into a tussle and knock the TV off the entertainment unit while chasing each other around the house while John and Cindy are out shopping.
[You could substitute: John parks the vehicle and he and Cindy go into the market to get some beer and hot dogs to consume while watching the big game on their new TV. When they come out of the store, the vehicle has obviously been broken into and the TV is gone. No coverage for the theft under the auto policy, but homeowner's insurance to the rescue (minus the deductible, of course)!
Why? Because homeowner's is a property policy in addition to a liability policy. Auto is primarily a liability policy, with an extension to collision and other-than-collision physical damage losses involving the covered vehicle(s).]
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 01:19 pm Post Subject:
If the tools were in the vehicle, I believe your Insurance DOES cover them. Also..(would like to ask)..you said you were driving a company vehicle? Do you have Business Insurance?
NO, NO, NO, as Max pointed out, these items are personal property and not covered (in fact excluded) by the auto policy..the ONLY exception would be using Max's John and Cindy's example, only this time John is not at fault, the other vehicle is, making Johns claim a third party claim, therefore his broken t.v. would be covered under the liability (PD) portion of the at fault party.
Bab, some HO/renters policys exclude or limit the amount of coverage for personal property that is stolen "while in or upon a land motor vehicle". You need to turn this in to your HO carrier.
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 04:58 pm Post Subject:
OP, your company may have an inland marine policy. If so, it may have coverage for your personal tools, subject to a deductible and limit (there can be coverage for Employer Tools and coverage for Employee Tools). If you work for a company with several employees who use their own tools on the job... as well as company tools... then they should have a Contractors Tools and Equipment endorsement on an Inland Marine policy.
A Business Personal Property policy is going to exclude coverage for tools more then 1000 feet from the business and their Business Auto Policy is also not going to cover tools as mentioned above.
If you have a home owners or renters policy it should also extend coverage if you owned the tools.
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 06:50 am Post Subject:
Finding your laptop after a theft without tracking software is an arduous task that his only a minimal chance of succeeding. Having your serial number is an essential part of recovery. Contact the local authorities as soon as you realize it has been missing, and scour eBay and local pawn shops. Even then, you are essentially searching for a needle in a haystack. A better alternative may be to look into preventative tools capable of preventing the theft in the first place, as well as tracking it in the event that it is stolen. There are several tools available.
================ Web Design Search Engine Marketing
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:55 am Post Subject: insurance
MAX and LORI:.........thanks. I really didin't realize what actually covers what. (Just thinking outloud here..) I REALLY need to get Renters Insurance. I've been looking around. I live in a trailer and I'm NOT surprised that alot the few Insurance Companies, in my area, don't 'cover' trailers. So...if I have Renters Insurance and something was stolen out of my car (an item that is NOT 'attached' to the car) then would it be covered under Renters Insurance?
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 12:25 pm Post Subject:
Hey tcope.. I've heard about inland marine policies before, but would like to have more information on this Contractors Tools and Equipment . I'm sure you'd come up with an explanation.
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 02:54 pm Post Subject:
inland marine policies
People have heard of them, and yet they don't know a thing about them. Blame that on those of us agents who fail to know our clients well enough to inform them of their risks. Or blame it on those insureds who do their insurance purchasing online, like buying a book at Amazon.com, but fail to read their contracts and have no idea that they have exposures to risks they "thought were fully covered".
Inland marine policies are kind of the "catch all" of property and casualty insurance. Standard property policies tend to exclude things that are too common or catastrophic in their likeliness to occur. Or which are supposed to be covered by other people's insurance -- like your household furniture while being transported by a moving company from one location to another.
There are no true "standard forms" when it comes to inland marine policies. They can and do vary considerably from one company to another in terms of what is covered or not, even though the policy names are identical.
But what most inland marine policies do when they cover something, is cover for almost every conceivable loss that could occur. It's known as "open perils" coverage. Unless a specific form of loss is named as an exclusion, there will be coverage for the loss.
Frequently, things like tools and equipment are personal property, rather than property of a business. When that's the case, if they are "tools of the trade", they will not be covered (or only covered with very limited liability) by a personal form of insurance, such as homeowner's.
Lots of people have cameras. And digital cameras these days range from a few tens of dollars to a few thousands of dollars. If the owner is a "hobbyist" his coverage under a homeowner's policy is greater than if he is a "professional" who earns money with his cameras. So the professional photographer can obtain an inland marine policy to cover theft or other loss of his "tools and equipment" (fire, flood, earthquake, falling objects, and more) -- just about anything other than wear-and-tear (mechanical breakdown).
But coverage for camera equipment in a homeowner's policy is very limited. The hobbyist photographer who chooses to purchase a top-of-the-line Nikon or Canon digital camera would not have sufficient coverage for its loss by fire or theft in a standard homeowner's policy, and would be strongly encouraged to obtain an inland marine policy for protection. For the professional photographer, it is a must.
A personal chef has knives, pots and pans, storage containers, portable ranges, stoves, and grills, and similar tools and equipment. They can range in value from a few dollars to thousands of dollars -- each. None would be covered by his/her homeowner's policy. None are covered by a General Liability policy for property losses.
A framing (or finish) carpenter, drywall installer, roofer, electrician, painter, concrete contractor, and so on, each has different "tools and equipment" they use in their trades. Many are common to all, like hammers and utility knives, but some are specialized, like a concrete pump or a D-5 Caterpillar tractor. Few carpenters have a need for a backhoe.
So whatever a person's trade or occupation, a "Contractor's" Tools and Equipment inland marine policy can be totally customized for the specific items and risks involved.
The premium will generally correspond to the insurer's expectation of paying a claim and the value of the property being insured. The higher the risk, the higher the value, the higher the premium.
Homeowner's insurance only provides limited coverage for common items, such as fur coats, fine art, china and silverware, guns, coin and stamp collections, electronic equipment, golf equipment, and more. Persons with greater risk of financial loss in any of these areas (usually in excess of $1000-$2500) can obtain inland marine "floaters" to cover them.
Traveling to Europe (or Asia, Africa, Australia, South America, or Antarctica)? Homeowner's will cover limited losses to personal property, but an inland marine "Personal Articles Floater" will provide both a substantially greater amount and breadth of coverage. And most Personal Articles Floaters have no deductible, compared to one's homeowner's policy that could have a $500 or $1000 or greater deductible.
Many good reasons why inland marine policies offer great value in exchange for the relatively few premium dollars necessary to obtain them.
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 01:31 am Post Subject: insurance
If the tools were in the vehicle, I believe your Insurance DOES cover them. Also..(would like to ask)..you said you were driving a company vehicle? Do you have Business Insurance?
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 12:00 pm Post Subject:
If the tools were your personal property, you would have a better chance of collecting on your homeowner's policy than on an auto policy (subject to the limit of coverage and any deductible). I assume when you state "I drive a company vehicle" that you are not the owner of the company.
Your company's auto coverage probably does not include coverage for your tools, nor would their commercial theft coverage apply to your tools in most cases. If the tools belong to the company, then they would need some form of theft coverage on the tools.
Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 12:06 pm Post Subject: insurance
Why wouldn't the tools be covered under an auto policy, if they were in a vehicle, when they were stolen?
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 12:57 am Post Subject:
Well, let's examine the purpose of auto insurance. There are two basic types of losses that can result from the ownership and operation of a motor vehicle: injuries to others or their property, known as "liability" losses (must be due to the insured's negligence, payments are made to third parties). And there can be physical damage losses to the insured vehicle.
In addition to this, an auto policy can be extended to cover injuries to occupants of the vehicle -- "medical payments" -- or to the insured and resident members of their household (but not roommates or temporary guests/visitors) as a pedestrian if struck by an automobile.
The physical damage losses are categorized into collision and other-than-collision, sometimes known as "comprehensive". It's the other-than-collision section that covers additional vehicle-related losses such as theft, and burglary of the auto resulting in damage to doors, windows, and theft of permanently attached items such as "sound reproduction equipment" (stereo radios, CD players, DVD players).
Losses can also include those caused by or suffered by certain towed items (trailers, boats, other vehicles).
But the auto policy is not a "property" policy like a homeowner's policy. "Contents" (personal property not attached to the vehicle) are not normally covered by auto policies. But most personal property is normally covered under a homeowner's or tenant's policy anywhere in the world to a limited extent (depends on the type of property).
A common scenario that we teach to illustrate the concept is this: John and Cindy drive to the electronics store and purchase a 52" big screen TV. They load it into their SUV and head home to watch the big game. But in their excitement, John is a bit inattentive, fails to stop for a red light, and collides with an oncoming vehicle that has turned left into his path.
John is determined to be at-fault for the collision. In addition to his vehicle's damage, the big screen TV is also damaged beyond repair. John suffers minor injuries and Cindy receives a broken arm while shielding her face from the passenger air bag.
How will the damages be paid?
(1) John's liability coverage pays for the damages to the other vehicle and to any occupants of that vehicle, up to his policy limits.
(2) John's collision coverage pays for the damages to his vehicle, less the deductible.
(3) John's policy's Medical Payments coverage pays for his injuries and for Cindy's injuries up to the individual limits per person (commonly $1000 to $5000). This coverage is "excess" if John and Cindy also have health insurance (their medical insurance pays first. So let's say they have a $500 emergency room copay on their PPO policy, the auto policy medical payments will cover that out of pocket expense).
(4) There is no part of the auto policy that covers the big screen TV -- although it can be considered "sound reproduction equipment" -- because it is not "permanently attached".
(5) However, John's homeowner's policy covers newly acquired property, and will pay the replacement cost of the TV, less the deductible, same as if his dog and cat get into a tussle and knock the TV off the entertainment unit while chasing each other around the house while John and Cindy are out shopping.
[You could substitute: John parks the vehicle and he and Cindy go into the market to get some beer and hot dogs to consume while watching the big game on their new TV. When they come out of the store, the vehicle has obviously been broken into and the TV is gone. No coverage for the theft under the auto policy, but homeowner's insurance to the rescue (minus the deductible, of course)!
Why? Because homeowner's is a property policy in addition to a liability policy. Auto is primarily a liability policy, with an extension to collision and other-than-collision physical damage losses involving the covered vehicle(s).]
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 01:19 pm Post Subject:
If the tools were in the vehicle, I believe your Insurance DOES cover them. Also..(would like to ask)..you said you were driving a company vehicle? Do you have Business Insurance?
NO, NO, NO, as Max pointed out, these items are personal property and not covered (in fact excluded) by the auto policy..the ONLY exception would be using Max's John and Cindy's example, only this time John is not at fault, the other vehicle is, making Johns claim a third party claim, therefore his broken t.v. would be covered under the liability (PD) portion of the at fault party.Bab, some HO/renters policys exclude or limit the amount of coverage for personal property that is stolen "while in or upon a land motor vehicle". You need to turn this in to your HO carrier.
Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 04:58 pm Post Subject:
OP, your company may have an inland marine policy. If so, it may have coverage for your personal tools, subject to a deductible and limit (there can be coverage for Employer Tools and coverage for Employee Tools). If you work for a company with several employees who use their own tools on the job... as well as company tools... then they should have a Contractors Tools and Equipment endorsement on an Inland Marine policy.
A Business Personal Property policy is going to exclude coverage for tools more then 1000 feet from the business and their Business Auto Policy is also not going to cover tools as mentioned above.
If you have a home owners or renters policy it should also extend coverage if you owned the tools.
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 06:50 am Post Subject:
Finding your laptop after a theft without tracking software is an arduous task that his only a minimal chance of succeeding. Having your serial number is an essential part of recovery. Contact the local authorities as soon as you realize it has been missing, and scour eBay and local pawn shops. Even then, you are essentially searching for a needle in a haystack. A better alternative may be to look into preventative tools capable of preventing the theft in the first place, as well as tracking it in the event that it is stolen. There are several tools available.
================
Web Design
Search Engine Marketing
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 10:55 am Post Subject: insurance
MAX and LORI:.........thanks. I really didin't realize what actually covers what. (Just thinking outloud here..) I REALLY need to get Renters Insurance. I've been looking around. I live in a trailer and I'm NOT surprised that alot the few Insurance Companies, in my area, don't 'cover' trailers. So...if I have Renters Insurance and something was stolen out of my car (an item that is NOT 'attached' to the car) then would it be covered under Renters Insurance?
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 12:25 pm Post Subject:
Hey tcope.. I've heard about inland marine policies before, but would like to have more information on this Contractors Tools and Equipment . I'm sure you'd come up with an explanation.
Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 02:54 pm Post Subject:
inland marine policies
People have heard of them, and yet they don't know a thing about them. Blame that on those of us agents who fail to know our clients well enough to inform them of their risks. Or blame it on those insureds who do their insurance purchasing online, like buying a book at Amazon.com, but fail to read their contracts and have no idea that they have exposures to risks they "thought were fully covered".
Inland marine policies are kind of the "catch all" of property and casualty insurance. Standard property policies tend to exclude things that are too common or catastrophic in their likeliness to occur. Or which are supposed to be covered by other people's insurance -- like your household furniture while being transported by a moving company from one location to another.
There are no true "standard forms" when it comes to inland marine policies. They can and do vary considerably from one company to another in terms of what is covered or not, even though the policy names are identical.
But what most inland marine policies do when they cover something, is cover for almost every conceivable loss that could occur. It's known as "open perils" coverage. Unless a specific form of loss is named as an exclusion, there will be coverage for the loss.
Frequently, things like tools and equipment are personal property, rather than property of a business. When that's the case, if they are "tools of the trade", they will not be covered (or only covered with very limited liability) by a personal form of insurance, such as homeowner's.
Lots of people have cameras. And digital cameras these days range from a few tens of dollars to a few thousands of dollars. If the owner is a "hobbyist" his coverage under a homeowner's policy is greater than if he is a "professional" who earns money with his cameras. So the professional photographer can obtain an inland marine policy to cover theft or other loss of his "tools and equipment" (fire, flood, earthquake, falling objects, and more) -- just about anything other than wear-and-tear (mechanical breakdown).
But coverage for camera equipment in a homeowner's policy is very limited. The hobbyist photographer who chooses to purchase a top-of-the-line Nikon or Canon digital camera would not have sufficient coverage for its loss by fire or theft in a standard homeowner's policy, and would be strongly encouraged to obtain an inland marine policy for protection. For the professional photographer, it is a must.
A personal chef has knives, pots and pans, storage containers, portable ranges, stoves, and grills, and similar tools and equipment. They can range in value from a few dollars to thousands of dollars -- each. None would be covered by his/her homeowner's policy. None are covered by a General Liability policy for property losses.
A framing (or finish) carpenter, drywall installer, roofer, electrician, painter, concrete contractor, and so on, each has different "tools and equipment" they use in their trades. Many are common to all, like hammers and utility knives, but some are specialized, like a concrete pump or a D-5 Caterpillar tractor. Few carpenters have a need for a backhoe.
So whatever a person's trade or occupation, a "Contractor's" Tools and Equipment inland marine policy can be totally customized for the specific items and risks involved.
The premium will generally correspond to the insurer's expectation of paying a claim and the value of the property being insured. The higher the risk, the higher the value, the higher the premium.
Homeowner's insurance only provides limited coverage for common items, such as fur coats, fine art, china and silverware, guns, coin and stamp collections, electronic equipment, golf equipment, and more. Persons with greater risk of financial loss in any of these areas (usually in excess of $1000-$2500) can obtain inland marine "floaters" to cover them.
Traveling to Europe (or Asia, Africa, Australia, South America, or Antarctica)? Homeowner's will cover limited losses to personal property, but an inland marine "Personal Articles Floater" will provide both a substantially greater amount and breadth of coverage. And most Personal Articles Floaters have no deductible, compared to one's homeowner's policy that could have a $500 or $1000 or greater deductible.
Many good reasons why inland marine policies offer great value in exchange for the relatively few premium dollars necessary to obtain them.
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