by Mommyof6 » Sun Aug 23, 2009 08:25 am
Hello. I live in Oklahoma and we have Geico as our car insurance. My husband said our insurance is $25,000 $50,000 and $25,000 . I don't exactly understand that but it's what he told me when I asked how much insurance we had. He said full coverage however no rental and I guess we had no medical insurance since I was at fault and it was a one car
accident.
basic info
My truck is a 2003 Chevy Tahoe Ls with between 85,000 and 86,000 miles
V8 4.8 Liter engine
4WD
automatic
Air Conditioning
rear air
Tilt control
Dual Front Air Bags
bows speaker system
power steering
power doors and windows
Dual Power Seats
roof rack.
Sony CD player
does not have 4 wheel drive.
it is a 8 seater and I am the second owner. ( Had two bench seats to fit 8 instead of one bench seat and 2 bucket seats not sure if that matters or not but when we bought it the dealership said they had it ordered to fit 8 instead of 7 )
The truck was in very good condition with no dents before the accident paint and everything was good ( not pealing or scratched up)
We are financing the truck and our buy out price is $10,500 if we paid it off today, more if we made payments if we drop the warranty then it's less then $10,500 ( not sure if we could drop warranty after the accident) Wynn's is our warranty company and the warranty price is rolled into the cost of the truck and comes out of monthly payments)
OK so now on to the accident.
I was driving my children to get breakfast and then school Friday morning, they usually take bus but it was raining. I unfortunately Hydroplaned into a brick mailbox and the truck was damaged. I am telling you the mail box was a super mail box!
I hit right in the middle of the front of the truck but damage to the full front area of truck , Side I believe was fine.
The truck was taken to the shop the same day of the accident and so far the adjuster says the following is broke, front bumper ( which was on the ground after the accident, hood which buckled , lights , grill, radiator, hose to radiator and driver air bag and fan ( he says this was the obvious stuff that was broken). He was unable to take apart the engine or transmission Friday but said it would be done over the weekend. The SUV would not start at all after the accident.It had no power when they tried to start it back up and I can't remember if it was running right after the accident. They did check and see if the battery was damaged or lose and it was not but the truck still got no power and would not start.
He did say the frame was not bent as I hit in the middle of the truck and he says there is 8 inches in the middle where the frame does not connect ( and thats where I hit). Said there was no frame support where It was hit. the front where bumper was is buckled in about a foot.
I am hoping I am explaining the damage correctly. Can anyone tell me the chance that part of the engine or transmission is damaged? I understand you may not beable to tell me without seeing my truck but was wondering what your experiance with these types of accidents was. A little birdy told me you guys are great here and very friendly so I thought i'd ask.
Here is two photo's my husband found that he said looked the damage ou SUV has He said it looks like this hood but ours hood was more crumbled.
and then this front except ours is dented in a bit more and it was in the center (caved in)
the bumper was completely off . So he said The hood on first car and the front on this car is how the SUV looks.( but ours didn't cave in the sides like on the 2nd car all damage done to front and hood.)
I am horrified if or when they fix it and we will have trouble later ( Engine runs great and I can't even hear the engine when I'm driving) I guess I've read to many bad stories about the troubles after a accident with engines and transmissions. Or that they will total it out ( Not sure if there is enough damage for that although OH MY GOSH it looks SOOOOO bad) but my other fear is if they total it out we won't get $10500 after deductible * which is $1000* leaving us more to pay on the SUV .We don't have Gap I am for sure getting it for now on! NADA's clean retail price is $12,275 for my area and KBB"s retail price is $13,590 for my area . IF they total the truck out and IF they go by them two prices I should get between ($12,000 and $14,000) and that would be enough for our buy out price ( after they minus the $1000 for deductible) and would leave us owing the loan company nothing. Is this correct?
I have researched our newspaper and other areas in our town also and the prices are even higher priced then the sites , I seen a few a bit lower but they had a lot more miles.
I am counting my blessings that my children are OK and that I was not hurt worse , Just bruised my lower back , my ribs, my chest where the seat belt was and a burn on my arm ( from the stuff in the airbag) . My knee and my pelvic area hurts but besides that we are all OK.
can anyone calm my fears about the horrible insurance stories I'm hearing about them not fixing it correctly and or not giving you enough to pay off the SUV when the fair market value is more then the SUV cost.
Thank you so much for your time, I'm sorry If I've went on and on this whole thing has just been so horrible , I hope and pray to never get in a accident again. I just can't believe I wrecked our SUV . No matter how much someone says it was a accident and I shouldn't beat myself up over it, I am. My husband is a Deputy and says he See's accidents like this in the rain all the time but I always thought I was such a good driver.
Also one more question does anyone know about how much the insurance rates go up after a at fault accident? ( I have no tickets or any other accidents on record)
Mommyof6 [/img]
accident.
basic info
My truck is a 2003 Chevy Tahoe Ls with between 85,000 and 86,000 miles
V8 4.8 Liter engine
4WD
automatic
Air Conditioning
rear air
Tilt control
Dual Front Air Bags
bows speaker system
power steering
power doors and windows
Dual Power Seats
roof rack.
Sony CD player
does not have 4 wheel drive.
it is a 8 seater and I am the second owner. ( Had two bench seats to fit 8 instead of one bench seat and 2 bucket seats not sure if that matters or not but when we bought it the dealership said they had it ordered to fit 8 instead of 7 )
The truck was in very good condition with no dents before the accident paint and everything was good ( not pealing or scratched up)
We are financing the truck and our buy out price is $10,500 if we paid it off today, more if we made payments if we drop the warranty then it's less then $10,500 ( not sure if we could drop warranty after the accident) Wynn's is our warranty company and the warranty price is rolled into the cost of the truck and comes out of monthly payments)
OK so now on to the accident.
I was driving my children to get breakfast and then school Friday morning, they usually take bus but it was raining. I unfortunately Hydroplaned into a brick mailbox and the truck was damaged. I am telling you the mail box was a super mail box!
I hit right in the middle of the front of the truck but damage to the full front area of truck , Side I believe was fine.
The truck was taken to the shop the same day of the accident and so far the adjuster says the following is broke, front bumper ( which was on the ground after the accident, hood which buckled , lights , grill, radiator, hose to radiator and driver air bag and fan ( he says this was the obvious stuff that was broken). He was unable to take apart the engine or transmission Friday but said it would be done over the weekend. The SUV would not start at all after the accident.It had no power when they tried to start it back up and I can't remember if it was running right after the accident. They did check and see if the battery was damaged or lose and it was not but the truck still got no power and would not start.
He did say the frame was not bent as I hit in the middle of the truck and he says there is 8 inches in the middle where the frame does not connect ( and thats where I hit). Said there was no frame support where It was hit. the front where bumper was is buckled in about a foot.
I am hoping I am explaining the damage correctly. Can anyone tell me the chance that part of the engine or transmission is damaged? I understand you may not beable to tell me without seeing my truck but was wondering what your experiance with these types of accidents was. A little birdy told me you guys are great here and very friendly so I thought i'd ask.
Here is two photo's my husband found that he said looked the damage ou SUV has He said it looks like this hood but ours hood was more crumbled.
and then this front except ours is dented in a bit more and it was in the center (caved in)
the bumper was completely off . So he said The hood on first car and the front on this car is how the SUV looks.( but ours didn't cave in the sides like on the 2nd car all damage done to front and hood.)
I am horrified if or when they fix it and we will have trouble later ( Engine runs great and I can't even hear the engine when I'm driving) I guess I've read to many bad stories about the troubles after a accident with engines and transmissions. Or that they will total it out ( Not sure if there is enough damage for that although OH MY GOSH it looks SOOOOO bad) but my other fear is if they total it out we won't get $10500 after deductible * which is $1000* leaving us more to pay on the SUV .We don't have Gap I am for sure getting it for now on! NADA's clean retail price is $12,275 for my area and KBB"s retail price is $13,590 for my area . IF they total the truck out and IF they go by them two prices I should get between ($12,000 and $14,000) and that would be enough for our buy out price ( after they minus the $1000 for deductible) and would leave us owing the loan company nothing. Is this correct?
I have researched our newspaper and other areas in our town also and the prices are even higher priced then the sites , I seen a few a bit lower but they had a lot more miles.
I am counting my blessings that my children are OK and that I was not hurt worse , Just bruised my lower back , my ribs, my chest where the seat belt was and a burn on my arm ( from the stuff in the airbag) . My knee and my pelvic area hurts but besides that we are all OK.
can anyone calm my fears about the horrible insurance stories I'm hearing about them not fixing it correctly and or not giving you enough to pay off the SUV when the fair market value is more then the SUV cost.
Thank you so much for your time, I'm sorry If I've went on and on this whole thing has just been so horrible , I hope and pray to never get in a accident again. I just can't believe I wrecked our SUV . No matter how much someone says it was a accident and I shouldn't beat myself up over it, I am. My husband is a Deputy and says he See's accidents like this in the rain all the time but I always thought I was such a good driver.
Also one more question does anyone know about how much the insurance rates go up after a at fault accident? ( I have no tickets or any other accidents on record)
Mommyof6 [/img]
Posted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 11:58 am Post Subject:
Hello Mommy, first off honey..ya' got me confused..you've listed
4WD
as an option then saydoes not have 4 wheel drive.
Double check that because this is a big difference, for now I'll check withOUT four wheel drive...I get an ACV of
$12, 025, but a few options you didn't mention, if it has rear bucket seats +100.00, rear entertainment system +250-tow package +125- w/o 3rd rear seat (minus) -125-running boards +100, wITH 4x4 +850.
( not sure if we could drop warranty after the accident)
If it's totaled yes, you will get a prorata payment back on the unused portion of the warranty.He did say the frame was not bent as I hit in the middle of the truck and he says there is 8 inches in the middle where the frame does not connect ( and thats where I hit). Said there was no frame support where It was hit. the front where bumper was is buckled in about a foot.
He's right about there being no frame in the middle, but hat in no way means there is no frame damage, if you 'pole hit' hard enough in the center, you can pull both front horns/rails toward the front (pigeon toed).Doesn't mean there is frame damage either, I just think it should be correctd, that you most certainly don't need a direct hit to the frame to have frame damage..But frame damage can be repaired too..Don't get stuck on that...until the vehicle has been torn down and inspected..I am hoping I am explaining the damage correctly.
Can anyone tell me the chance that part of the engine or transmission is damaged? I understand you may not beable to tell me without seeing my truck but was wondering what your experiance with these types of accidents was. A little birdy told me you guys are great here and very friendly so I thought i'd ask.
Hard to say without seeing the vehicle, or estimate, but sounds slim to none to me...If I remember correctly there is quite a bit of distance between the core support, (which you didn't mention was damaged) cooling/fans etc before you get close to the motor..Believe it or not, most engines are not damaged in collision impacts...And honey these pictures are of unibody cars, not full frame vehicles (which yours is).. impacts will react differently in these vehicles. The tranny sets quite a way back (from your discription) of the impact I'd be surprised if either the motor or tranny were damaged. There could be a ton of reasons it wouldn't start. If the radiator lost it's fluid, I think this vehicle has a sensor that will shut the motor down, to keep from blowing the motor.Is this correct?
Yes, and you would get the balance, but from what you've said it doesn't sound like a total to me..yet anyway...can anyone calm my fears about the horrible insurance stories I'm hearing about them not fixing it correctly and
First of all remember (in anything) you always hear/read about the bad things NEVER the ga-zillion good/happy/satisfied people and claims. Same in every industry. Second your most important decision at this point is to pick a qualified shop. Make sure they have a warranty that backs their repairs. Try not to 'borrow trouble' You've nothing thus far to think that you're going to have any trouble. right? :wink:As to the ACV, it depends on the system your company uses to determine this. What company do you have? I might know which system they use.
not giving you enough to pay off the SUV when the fair market value is more then the SUV cost.
They will owe you the ACV (actual cash value) of your vehicle. It sounds to me like you'll be fine in the event of a total loss.Also one more question does anyone know about how much the insurance rates go up after a at fault accident? ( I have no tickets or any other accidents on record)
You'll have to check with your carrier on this...Some (if clean record) you will only lose your safe driver discount (if you have one) others you'll see a min. of a 10-15% increase. Some have 'accident forgiveness' if you've been with them a long time, and claims free. You'll need to ask them. One this is for sure though they cannot raise your rates mid term, you won't see this increase (if any) until your renewal.
Let us know after tear down, and what they find damaged, we're here if you have any additional questions or anything we can be of assistance with.
Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 04:38 am Post Subject:
I am sorry I was confused. it is a 2wd not a 4wd. Been a long few days. It has a 3rd roll bench seats. Geico is our insurance company.
I do have a few more questions. Should the seat belts be replaced that was in use during the accident to insure safety if they replace it. My husband told me to tell you the Fan was broke on the Tahoe also.
What questions should I ask the adjuster tomorrow when I speak to him?
I am trying really hard to not borrow trouble :-) It's just been so stressing. thinking about if I want it fixed or totaled and I just fear having trouble later down the road. I know I can't control if they fix or total it out just hope whatever happens it is the best for our family. I also know they could fix it and us have no trouble with it what so ever.
If they fix the truck do you know if Geico or the body shop ( they said they contract them out) Will allow us to pay out the $1000 deductable? We just adopted 4 kids recently( have 6 total now) and do not have $1000. We are thinking of doing a garage sale to raise the money.
I just wish this would of never happened ( I am sure everyone wishes that when they have a accident!) but the guilt just runs so deep. I just didnt want the kids to get wet in the rain. I feel so dumb!
Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 10:40 am Post Subject:
Should the seat belts be replaced that was in use during the accident to insure safety if they replace it.
It depends...if the pretensioners (if equiped) are damaged most certainly...let me look this up..ok it says, ''all seatbelts in use at time of air bag deployment' must be replaced. So to answer your question..yes..My husband told me to tell you the Fan was broke on the Tahoe also.
The accident most likely took out all the coolint (a.c. cond.rad., fans, any coolers up front and core support)..I see this type of damage in nearly all front end hits, but maybe one out of a thousand will have any motor damage...What questions should I ask the adjuster tomorrow when I speak to him?
Well, you'll want to know how much damage, is it a total, tell him/her you looked on line and all seatbelts in use at the time of a.b. deployment must be replaced..also any of those kids in a car seat? If so the seats also may need to be replaced, it will generally say so on the side, (either inspect for damage after collision or replace)...ask what system they use to determine a vehicles ACV...Will allow us to pay out the $1000 deductable?
If it's totaled this is moot, it will simply be deducted from what they pay out. Same with repairs, except you will most likely have to pay it in full (to the shop) when the repairs are completed, or they won't release your vehicle. If the car fixes talk to the shop about any payment schedule they may have, some shops do this most do not.We are thinking of doing a garage sale to raise the money.
That's a good idea...Also 'if' repairable ask the adjuster that is inspecting your vehicle if there are any appearance allowance opportunites that would reduce your deductible. An appearance allowance is when you are given money to live with the less than perfect 'appearance' of an item rather than replacing it (ie scratch on running board)...or after the estimate is complete ask the shop if there is anything on the estimate that doesn't HAVE to be replaced, and can be take off the deductible instead.I feel so dumb!
Don't..everyone thinks this after an accident...that's what you pay your premiums for, to insure yourself against stupidity...I'll make you feel better (i hope)...I've had two accidents in my life that were my fault (I've been driving 33 years!)...both accidents? I rear ended attorneys! yep, attorneys...both times...at lights or signs, not paying attention (duh) and rolled into the back of them...now THAT is dumb!Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 01:55 pm Post Subject:
.
.
There are two technicalities I would like to clarify in the comment below.
Also 'if' repairable ask the adjuster that is inspecting your vehicle if there are any appearance allowance opportunites that would reduce your deductible. An appearance allowance is when you are given money to live with the less than perfect 'appearance' of an item rather than replacing it (ie scratch on running board)...
Note: ACV = Actual Cash Value
1... Deductible:
No matter what the total value of your claim is... your Deductible will remain $1000.oo. A deductible is an pre-arranged amount that you and your insurer have agreed would be "Deducted" from the total amount owed to you by your insurer for any claim regardless of the amount. $10,200.97 ACV they subtract $1000.oo and issue a check for $9200.97. $1055.23 ACV... they subtract $1000.oo and issue a check for $55.23 It is not a _Repairer_ related item. A repairer can neither increase or reduce your deductible.
What a Repairer can (and should) do is Bill for the Actual cost of the repairs Authorized by the car owner and performed by the repairer.
2... Appearance Allowance:
Appears to be for the benefit of the insurance company. Using the example "(ie scratch on running board)". Let's say the cost to repair & re-paint it is $320.oo. Making $320.oo the ACV of that damage. At this point $320.oo would be added to the Loss Amount aka Check. But..... if one accepts a lets say $100.oo Appearance Allowance offer, only $100.oo would be added to the Loss Amount aka Check.
If everything else Totals lets say... $9,000.oo then the "running board" repair would make a total of $9,320.oo. As opposed to adding the "Appearance Allowance" of $100.oo for a total of $9,100.oo. Saving the Insurance Co. $220.oo.
Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 03:21 pm Post Subject:
If you are concerned about the quality and scope of repairs and whether they were completed sufficiently to restore your vehicle to pre accident condition, I would be happy to perform a limited free visual inspection of the completed repairs as a public safety service to you and your family if you live in the North East section of Oklahoma or could drive as far as Miami, Oklahoma.
Sometimes if you make known, your intent, that you plan on having the work inspected by a third party collision expert after completion of the repairs, they may pay special attention to your repair and not cut corners, or fall prey to an insurer that attempts to use cost savings measures at the consumer's expense.
Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 07:51 pm Post Subject:
Thank you everyone and Mike we are in Edmond so we may do that.
The adjuster just talked to my husband and told him there is $6500 worth of damage and its borer line if it will be totaled or not.He said they are going over the SUV again ( the Teck is) and if he finds anything else it may be a total loss .
My husband let him know we would reather it a total as long as we get fair market value bc of our fears he said he would remember that .
He is submitting how many miles and the damage to Geico now he says. ( well after they make sure nothing else is wrong)
My husband didnt mention what was wrong but I'll let you know when I find out.
If we want a second opnion how do we go about this?
Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:41 pm Post Subject:
Ok everyone they said it is a total loss. They are offering $10,100 after the deductable and tax. To pay off the SUV we would need $10,500 after deductable do we ask for more money? We would like to get $11,500 after deductable as that leaves enough for $1000 down on another SUV.
so do we ask for $12,500 ( then after they take the $1000 deductable it would leave us $11,500) ? The sites show our truck is worth more around $13,000 Not the $11,000 they offered before Deductable * $10,100 after deductable)
What is the chance of asking for more and actully getting more?
Posted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 03:44 am Post Subject:
Check to see if you have the appraisal clause in your policy if you and your insuer dispute the value.
Ask for their paperwork on how they arrived at the value of the loss.
Start looking for comparable vehicles or checking the sources they used to see if the vehicles in their comps even exist or if the options are similar.
Go to Edmunds.com or nada.com and appraise your car yourself then look online in your area for comps on autotrader.com online or cars.com
Low mileage used car values are up at the moment and their data may not reflect that uptake in value.
See if you can accept the undisputed value and invoke your appraisal clause for the difference. If they say no, have them put that in writing.
Posted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:50 am Post Subject:
Mommy, Mike gave you some good advise, use it..
We would like to get $11,500 after deductable as that leaves enough for $1000 down on another SUV.
You have to prove your vehicles value...you can't and won't get anywhere telling them you 'like' to have ''x'' amount so you can get into another car...That isn't their problem or concern. Nor should it be. They owe you for the ACV of your vehicle..you'll need to prove your value...What you think your vehicle is worth, isn't going to get you another penny, but if you can prove their assessment is incorrect, or low, you'll get somewhere. Before invoking your appraisal claus (if you have one-because this will likely cost you)..Do some research, market surveys with local used car dealers etc. Most important is (as Mike stated) get a copy of their assessment, and make sure everything is correct, (ie mileage, model, options etc). Was there any deductions for prior unrepaired damage?Also did they tell you the salvage buy back amount? Does anyone know if the 'cash for clunkers' pertains to wrecked vehicles?
Fred, you (again) cut off part of my quote, thus misrepresenting it again...I ALSO said,
or after the estimate is complete ask the shop if there is anything on the estimate that doesn't HAVE to be replaced, and can be take off the deductible instead.
Now what does that mean Fred? hmmm? That means the entire amount of that part including the labor is taken off the deductible does it not? :roll: geeze, Fred, I'm sorry but that's just plain irritating..when you take it upon yourself to 'edit' a post, in an apparent attempt to show that that was the only option (AA) that was mentioned.....now had you explained the AA (by way of my post as you did), then said something like, "Lori ALSO said you and the shop can work this out between you...thus removing the ENTIRE amount (rather than a portion) from the estimate and your deductible" that would've been fair wouldn't it? and an accruate dipiction of my post and intent...but then that wouldn't further your platform..would it? :roll: Just an fyi, for you...When "I" give an appearance allowance it is for the entire amount...every single time...Posted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 06:31 pm Post Subject:
I have had vehicle owners simply type a letter requesting to invoke the appraisal clause or asking about the process only to have a substantially better offer for their loss presented. If the vehicle owner has to hire an appraiser Usually 150 to 250 dollars they have to agree to elect an umpire that is agreeable to both. They do not always have to use the umpire unless the independent appraisers can not agree. The insurer also has to pay to hire an outside appraiser and they are not supposed to have any influence or set any criteria on that appraiser or limit their scope. :wink:
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