by Guest » Wed Jan 21, 2009 05:29 am
Hello Everyone,
I read this topic in a couple of posts, so this matter is no surprise, but this case is a bit differnt.
My father committed suicide a few months ago, he had changed his beneficiary on his group life insurance (from work) just a bit over five week before committing the act. He changed it to a woman who he had only been with for 6 months. Before this he still had the ex-girlfriends name on it.
Now, my mother and father had divorced 10 years earlier, and neither of us kids have been on his life insurance, We just started re-building our relationship for the last three years, and we were close. My father called me 2-3 times a week, then when this woman really started getting in my father was appearing to be alienated from me and the calls were becoming less.
The ex-girlfriend had access to his "online" benefits, and 'AFTER" he passed, she confirmed that he changed the beneficiary, so she changed it back to herself again. I turned her in, and she is now being investigated for fraud. Wit the other woman, before my father met her, he was doing very well, new house, new Harley, new dog, money in the bank, etc. After he had met her, she was married, and going through a foreclosure. Third marriage, and second foreclosure.
My fahter's ex confirmed that after we started talking again, she was to carry out some wishes for his insurance........ buy me a house, pay my debt, and give money to my two kids for college. But now, because it has been changed, it is no longer going to work that way. The investigation was suppose to be closed as soon as the coroner confirmed that it was a suicide, and signed off on the DC, they were calling it cut aqnd dry, and was not even going to have the DA look it over. I had two visits with the detective to have him court order her phone records, felt she had heard my father's message stating that she was going to kill him self. He would not do it, said there was no cause to do so.
Went over his head and finally got the Lt do do it, once received, it did in fact show she answered her messages, and he sent it to the DA to make sure they were not missing a criminal. DA said it because in WI, it was not a crime to commit suicide, he was not able to charge her with duty to aid, but is writing up a letter (have not seen as of yet), but I do have a case for a civil.
Before I had done all of this, I had already contested the life insurance on the basis of my father not being of right mind and character flaw on her behalf. Received three letter, third one being a beneficiary packet. I called and said, if I am not the beneficiary, then why am I receiving this and asking for the DC and final record?? Are you saying I am the beneficiary?? They said no, I am saying that you are the Heir. So as time goes by (I have a lawer, but he is not very familar with life ensurance, but was willing to do what is needed) we finally receive the police report, and in it it said that the woman said she did receive something saying she was the beneficiary, but has not sent anything in (because of the problems in our family not believing her about my father's death) but she was not sure if she would in the future.
Just found out (which I knew) she sent paper work in, now, they are holding funds for a reasonable amount of time for me to take legal action. Also, in police report she stated, she knew of the change, and that a friend (who is a old man on oxygen) supposedly helped my father make the changes. If this were true, then why was her "First name spelled wrong, and he did not put her SS#?? She also stated that he should make me beneficiary, and she claims that he said, he did not know if I would waste the money. If this were true, then why would my father have taken on a big responsibility in co-sponsoring my husband, and why would he have not left anything for my children??
So, my lawyer is going to civil lit, but I am wanting to know, is there a chance of her not getting this?? I forgot, the police report that my lawyer received was not the full report, the PD released it before the investigation was closed (about 1 week later from sending the Beneficiary packet). Also, does the insurance company only go by the report, or do they take into account the contest letter??
Any info would be greatly appreciated.
I read this topic in a couple of posts, so this matter is no surprise, but this case is a bit differnt.
My father committed suicide a few months ago, he had changed his beneficiary on his group life insurance (from work) just a bit over five week before committing the act. He changed it to a woman who he had only been with for 6 months. Before this he still had the ex-girlfriends name on it.
Now, my mother and father had divorced 10 years earlier, and neither of us kids have been on his life insurance, We just started re-building our relationship for the last three years, and we were close. My father called me 2-3 times a week, then when this woman really started getting in my father was appearing to be alienated from me and the calls were becoming less.
The ex-girlfriend had access to his "online" benefits, and 'AFTER" he passed, she confirmed that he changed the beneficiary, so she changed it back to herself again. I turned her in, and she is now being investigated for fraud. Wit the other woman, before my father met her, he was doing very well, new house, new Harley, new dog, money in the bank, etc. After he had met her, she was married, and going through a foreclosure. Third marriage, and second foreclosure.
My fahter's ex confirmed that after we started talking again, she was to carry out some wishes for his insurance........ buy me a house, pay my debt, and give money to my two kids for college. But now, because it has been changed, it is no longer going to work that way. The investigation was suppose to be closed as soon as the coroner confirmed that it was a suicide, and signed off on the DC, they were calling it cut aqnd dry, and was not even going to have the DA look it over. I had two visits with the detective to have him court order her phone records, felt she had heard my father's message stating that she was going to kill him self. He would not do it, said there was no cause to do so.
Went over his head and finally got the Lt do do it, once received, it did in fact show she answered her messages, and he sent it to the DA to make sure they were not missing a criminal. DA said it because in WI, it was not a crime to commit suicide, he was not able to charge her with duty to aid, but is writing up a letter (have not seen as of yet), but I do have a case for a civil.
Before I had done all of this, I had already contested the life insurance on the basis of my father not being of right mind and character flaw on her behalf. Received three letter, third one being a beneficiary packet. I called and said, if I am not the beneficiary, then why am I receiving this and asking for the DC and final record?? Are you saying I am the beneficiary?? They said no, I am saying that you are the Heir. So as time goes by (I have a lawer, but he is not very familar with life ensurance, but was willing to do what is needed) we finally receive the police report, and in it it said that the woman said she did receive something saying she was the beneficiary, but has not sent anything in (because of the problems in our family not believing her about my father's death) but she was not sure if she would in the future.
Just found out (which I knew) she sent paper work in, now, they are holding funds for a reasonable amount of time for me to take legal action. Also, in police report she stated, she knew of the change, and that a friend (who is a old man on oxygen) supposedly helped my father make the changes. If this were true, then why was her "First name spelled wrong, and he did not put her SS#?? She also stated that he should make me beneficiary, and she claims that he said, he did not know if I would waste the money. If this were true, then why would my father have taken on a big responsibility in co-sponsoring my husband, and why would he have not left anything for my children??
So, my lawyer is going to civil lit, but I am wanting to know, is there a chance of her not getting this?? I forgot, the police report that my lawyer received was not the full report, the PD released it before the investigation was closed (about 1 week later from sending the Beneficiary packet). Also, does the insurance company only go by the report, or do they take into account the contest letter??
Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 08:46 am Post Subject:
Who was named as the beneficiary when the policy was written? How many times had your father changed the beneficiary in the policy? Who is the present beneficiary of the plan?
Contesting the beneficiary issue isn't easy. You need to understand that your father has the right to name anyone as beneficiary in his policy. However, if you can prove that he wasn't at the right state of mind when he changed the beneficiary name from to his girlfriend, you may have the chance to win the judgement in your favor.
~Jeremy
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:15 am Post Subject:
Chula, What is the present status of the case regarding your father's death? Why you father has committed suicide would definitely play an important role in the beneficiary contest. I think you will stand a chance if it can be proved that she has provoked the deceased for the suicide.
Really, there is too much information in the post but all jumbled-up. You may wish to go over the whole issue once more for better understanding of the forum members.
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:29 am Post Subject: insurance
I DO agree that your father DOES have a right to designate whoever he wants on his Insurance policy. I would think, however, he would have added his own children, to the policy, as well. CHULA..you said this woman went 'online' and changed the 'Beneficiary'? Can you PROVE that she did? Actually......when you do ANYTHING on line ( bank account, policies, etc.) you can find out the date and time the account, policy, etc. was accessed. I'm glad you're trying to get things straightened out. Can you give an update, please, how things are going? Thanks.
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:36 am Post Subject:
Also, does the insurance company only go by the report, or do they take into account the contest letter??
The settlement process passes through several phases and at times it becomes necessary for the carrier to scrutinize everything. Under many occasions I think more complicated claim requests get checked by a team of insurance investigators and it is not easy to predict which way it would ultimately go. But please do keep in touch and share the proceedings with us.
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 07:23 pm Post Subject: Better UnderstandingOf This
Hi Everyone,
I am sorry that I mangled my long post, but I have been so upset about all of this, that I just want to keep crying. Here, I am going to go through all of the facts again.
My father and I for the last three years have made a mens and re-built our relationship, and it was very strong. At the time we started all of this, my father was with a women he had been with for about 3-4 years. Even before we started talking, he put her on his group life insurance that was through work, and gave her instructions to give money to my kids for college. Aftre we became close again, he instructed her to buy me a house, and pay my debts.
I invited my father to come live with me (he had a house that he was selling, but was to far from his work) so it was closer for him to go to work. He stayed for about 2 months, then he found an apt. close to his job. Shortly after he sold his one house and purchased another that was in a great location for work, only 5 minutes from his job. He bought a harley, dog, and had money in the bank. Now, the ex-girlfriend was "Still" on his life insurance (my father was a procrastinator).
Then, about a year later, he met this "other" woman, he would visit her at her job every day, and eventually, they started dating sometime in April. As I said before, my father would call me 2-3 times a week, and if I did not answer or call back that day, he would keep calling and then I would have to listen to how worried he was. After a couple of months later, these calls became less and less, and I was lucky if he answered his phone, and lucky if he would call me once a month.
When I would finally talk to him, he started telling me that he was having financial difficulty and he was behind on his mortgage, and the are ready to turn his utilities off. I questioned as to whether or not this woman was helping him with anything (she was there every day, just did not move her stuff in) he said........ cause she does not have any money, but she helps, she buys me cigarettes. I was thinking WHAT????
So, in Aug at 3:47pm, (per ex-girlfriend's saying) my father changed the beneficiary to this woman who has moved in my father's house just 4 days before he committed suicide. Now, through this whole time she was married to husband number three, and going through foreclosure on house number two. My father knew about her ex-husband (as he would call him, but she did not file for divorce until Nov 16, "after" my father's death.
The day after my father's death we were at his house, and she "supposedly" went into detox (as her daughter put it, she is a professional alcoholic) cause she threatened suicide. But that same morning from detox (providing she was really there) she called the life insurance company to inquire about it. My father was not even cold!!!!!!!!
Since the death, I had went over the detective's who was on scene, because I believed she checked her voice mail. My father left 5 messages first one being, I am going to be dead, etc, etc. The Lt. court ordered the phone bill, and found out that she did in fact answer her messages, but she is playing the I was drunk and don't remember excuse. When we were at the house and she finally got there (from supposed detox) she was questioned by one of our family members........ Mind you, my father's car had been in a small "attached" garage that had all of her crap in it, and car had been running for a few hours)........ Did you not smell gas in the garage?? She said, NO. Did you not see smoke in the garage?? She said NO.
The night before my father did this, they were at the bar where she worked, my father had a couple of drinks (confirmed by coroner) and she continued to drink after her shift was over. My father was upset that she had another guy help her bring up alcohol up from the basement, he was not able to cause he had hernia surg. just few day b4. so they had a quiet argument (she admits) and he tries to get her to go home, but she doesn't. He gets home rearranges the garage, and then starts the process, along with calling her phone and leaving the five messages.
when she comes home, approx 2:15-2:30 am, she opens the garage door with the clicker, sees the car running, goes over to the car, yell at him don't be stupid, get in the house, turns car off, goes in house, opens doors, let's dogs out, and goes to bed. Do not remember if she called her voice mail b4 or after she was home,(I will have to go over the police report again).
She finally calls the police at about 10am. She has changed her story, first saying he ewnt for a walk, then saying maybe he didn't, and he shrugged his shoulders, then she played the I do not remember turning car off, I was drunk, when she stated (in police report) that she had; and she don't remember calling her voice mail, (when questioned for the third time), "SHE WAS DRUNK"!!!!!!!!
Now the fraud comes in with the "EX" girlfriend, she changed her name "BACK" to hers, after my father's death. She is being investigasted for fraud, and yes, I have proof, I was able to get into my father's e-mail, and had forwarded things I thought might be important, to my e-mail; three of which were confirmations with post death dates, confirming that, your beneficiary has been changed. Sent them to insurance company, and forward to the DA.
Now (per police report), from 9/1/05 until 8/25/2008 at 3:47pm (the time per EX) my father "NEVER" had a beneficiary for his optional life insurance. NEW girlfriend is in the picture and now, not only is she the beneficiary for his company life insurance, but his optional also?? When he has never had one in the past 3 years?? Why now??
My father never needed help before in changing or obtain the policy in the first place, why would he need the assistance of an old man who is on oxygen to help him now, unless he was not coherent, or she is lying. This same man was the first one there when I kicked her out of my father's house the day after his death, yelling and screaming that she "by law" does not have to move. She was only "actually" living there, with her "actual" stuff, for five days.
So here is where this whole story is so far, I received a beneficiary packet a week after Dec 17th, they said I'm not the beneficiary, but I am the heir. When I called and questioned why did I receive this if I am not the beneficiary and what is the reason they are requesting the full PD report and DC??
I get a call back a couple of weeks ago, and the message said, Funds are in pending status, until report is received, which has been confirmed with the Lt; and they are "waiting for additional information on the beneficiary's documentation". What does this mean??
Now, I spoke with my attorney this morning, and seems to think that the "EX" might have been the one who put in the claim (but is not sure, and can not remember the reasoning), and if it was the "EX" then we should just sit on it, and it will automatically turn to me, cause she committed fraud. But if it is not the "EX", then we can take it to court. Is there a way he or myself can obtain this info?? How do I know which way to go, court or not have to go to court??
I am sorry this is so long, but I am so depressed aqnd upset, that this woman prayed on my father's kindness and emotions for her own benefit. I cry every time I think about it, my father would still be alive if he never got involved with her. Someone please help me with advice or some info that can help me fight this woman.
WHY would I get a beneficiary packet??
How do I find out who sent in the claim??
Thank you everyone,
Chula
Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 07:28 pm Post Subject:
I have straightened my original post out so that everyone can understand it better.
I have signed up now, so I can receive PMs also. thank you again everyone.
Chula
Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 06:35 am Post Subject:
Quite complex! I think sdchargers' advice must work. Do not give up. All the best!
Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 05:50 am Post Subject:
your only hope is to prove your father was not of sound mind when he changed the beneficiary and that it was not at all his intention and even then it may be hard for you to do anything. Beneficiaries can be changed like your underwear. If you pay your policy, it is yours to leave to whomever you want. I wish you the best.
Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 11:28 pm Post Subject:
Well Jackson, this was evident when he killed himself.
Posted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 01:31 am Post Subject:
No, really it isn't. They won't look at it like that. Obviously he wasn't at the time he killed himself but I doubt he did so while on the phone changing his beneficiaries...
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