by Guest » Sun Oct 05, 2008 09:59 am
My Dad killed my mom, even though she was sick in the hospital, we are very sure that he sufficated her. He is a tax avaider and can not retire. He had about 1 million of insurance on her, 3 different policies. He knew that every day she was in the hospital, it took away from the life insurance, his only source of retirement, so he ended her life. He slipped up to my sister and said that your Mom did not sufficate, he tried to give her breaths of his own air, but never called a nurse or doctor in the room to help. He also refused an autopsy, he would not let her body go anywhere except to the funeral home. Also, he refused to take a polygraph test that we set up, an attorney called my sister the day of the test and told her that he was going to sue us for everything we got. We had so much proof, but not enough to have convicted, I don't think any of the investigators believed us. I have kinda of gave up, but it still will haunt us for the rest of our lives.
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 02:31 pm Post Subject:
An agreement with the hospital that the bill would be paid out of the proceeds from the insurance?
We need some clarification on this part of the discussion.
I have never heard of an "agreement" for payment of a hospital bill being secured by a life insurance policy.
What if the person lived another 40 years?
The hospital could not place a lien on the life insurance policy.
Since this person had no medical insurance, was the hospital bill being paid by a state Medicaid program?
One of the benefits of life insurance, is that the proceeds pass directly to a named beneficiary, outside the estate and outside the reach of creditors.
We are missing a part of this puzzle.
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 02:38 pm Post Subject: My Dad killed my Mom
Happened in Florida. I can not contact insurance companies, because I don't know which one's they are. My mother passed away in 2000. My father had no life insurance on him. Right now I am out of options in what to do...... I have tried to let things go over the years, but something inside keeps it going. I know that one day he will be punished for what he has done. God knows all and your sins will find you out. But, I still would like to see him convicted for the crime that he has committed. It would bput things to rest in my heart.
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 03:03 pm Post Subject:
If there was, in fact, an agreement between the hospital and the life insurance company, the hospital would know the name of the insurance company. Learning the name of the insurance company should not be a problem.
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 03:38 pm Post Subject:
Hurt, I am not sure what the statutes are for Florida but I don't think there is a statute of lim itations for murder. It really sounds like you should contact your states prosecuting office. Is the doctor still around that was treating her? Maybe some kind of paper from her would give your story reason for the state to act upon it.
I wonder if your mother was in the right framew mind durting all of this and was she at all suspicious? I know when it comes to brain tumors most people can not think clearly and sometimes can not get their mouth to say what they are thinking. I had a husband that had kidney cancer and it moved to his brain. He could not speak and I would have to read his eyes to try to understand him. If they went in the direction of the restroom I knew that I needed to help get hime there.
Cancer my friend is a very hard struggle for ALL involved,including yourself. It can sometimes take your life along with the loved ones. If you can't get anywhere with law enforcement maybe it is truly time to let go. Yes please believe me I know first handed how truly hard this is. Memories haunted me forever. There are support groups out there for free that you can attend.
If I can help you any further just ask. God Bless You.
Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:41 pm Post Subject:
I don't know what to make of this thread so I'm just going to comment on some things that aren't correct.
I'm not being harsh or unsympathetic I'm simply stating facts. If I copy and paste something someone wrote I'm not attacking that person I'm just commenting on what was said.
Hurt for money wrote:
He knew that every day she was in the hospital, it took away from the life insurance
That's false. Whether he knew it or not the hospital can't reach his life insurance benefit in Florida.
He also refused an autopsy,
Not his decision.
If law enforcement suspects foul play you can't stop them from performing an autopsy.
He also refused to sign any medical papers at the hospital, because he did not want to be held responcible for any of the medical cost.
He's a smart man for refusing to sign papers at the hospital.
This contradicts your previous statement:
He knew that every day she was in the hospital, it took away from the life insurance
My father was told that a hospital can lien life insurance policies in order to guarantee payment scense there was NO medical insurance.
That's false in Florida. They can't put a lien on the policies.
Xoseph wrote:
If it is proven that your father murdered your mother, this will render the policies null and void. In other words, these policies are as good as not in existence in the first place. This is because insurance purchase cannot violate public interest or laws. In this case, it is about murder.
If a person takes up an insurance policy on someone's life and subsequently murders the insured with the intention of getting the policy proceeds, insurance company has every right to repudiate the claim or deny any contractual obligation as if the policyholder has never applied for insurance before.
Not true. The policies are not null and void. The death benefit would be paid but NOT to the murderer. It would be paid to the contingent beneficiaries or to the estate. See Florida Statute 732.802 below.
Hurt for money wrote:
Happened in Florida.
Below are the pertinent Florida Statutes:
222.13 Life insurance policies; disposition of proceeds.--
.(1) Whenever any person residing in the state shall die leaving insurance on his or her life, the said insurance shall inure exclusively to the benefit of the person for whose use and benefit such insurance is designated in the policy, and the proceeds thereof shall be exempt from the claims of creditors of the insured unless the insurance policy or a valid assignment thereof provides otherwise
732.802 Killer not entitled to receive property or other benefits by reason of victim's death.--
(1) A surviving person who unlawfully and intentionally kills or participates in procuring the death of the decedent is not entitled to any benefits under the will or under the Florida Probate Code, and the estate of the decedent passes as if the killer had predeceased the decedent. Property appointed by the will of the decedent to or for the benefit of the killer passes as if the killer had predeceased the decedent.
(2) Any joint tenant who unlawfully and intentionally kills another joint tenant thereby effects a severance of the interest of the decedent so that the share of the decedent passes as the decedent's property and the killer has no rights by survivorship. This provision applies to joint tenancies with right of survivorship and tenancies by the entirety in real and personal property; joint and multiple-party accounts in banks, savings and loan associations, credit unions, and other institutions; and any other form of coownership with survivorship incidents.
(3) A named beneficiary of a bond, life insurance policy, or other contractual arrangement who unlawfully and intentionally kills the principal obligee or the person upon whose life the policy is issued is not entitled to any benefit under the bond, policy, or other contractual arrangement; and it becomes payable as though the killer had predeceased the decedent.
(4) Any other acquisition of property or interest by the killer, including a life estate in homestead property, shall be treated in accordance with the principles of this section.
(5) A final judgment of conviction of murder in any degree is conclusive for purposes of this section. In the absence of a conviction of murder in any degree, the court may determine by the greater weight of the evidence whether the killing was unlawful and intentional for purposes of this section.
(6) This section does not affect the rights of any person who, before rights under this section have been adjudicated, purchases from the killer for value and without notice property which the killer would have acquired except for this section, but the killer is liable for the amount of the proceeds or the value of the property. Any insurance company, bank, or other obligor making payment according to the terms of its policy or obligation is not liable by reason of this section unless prior to payment it has received at its home office or principal address written notice of a claim under this section.
Edit:
One more thing...there isn't any statute of limitation for murder.
Murder is forever and eventually they will get you.
Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:16 am Post Subject:
Wow You really make som e vaslid points here. I hope this wasn't a made up post..my heart was really going out to the poster.
Anyway at least a learned a little something here...I had always thought if murder was involved it nullified the policy.
It only seems fair that it wouldn't and it should be handed down to the family or estate.
Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:01 am Post Subject:
Maze I don't think there was an agreement with the ins company rather the dad 'assumed' he would be responsible for the bill and that pretty much is where the money came from..
Ok look honey, there is no statue of limitation on murder in ANY state...if she had all this ins dad had none.....hmmmmm red flag. Get your nerve and all your information together call and make an appointment with a detective in your city's police dept, and go talk to him...spill your guts...people are found guilty of things many times years and years after they 'thought' they'd gotten away with something...the money is likely gone,but I don't think that is your main issue anyway..
Are you still in contact with him? Does he have a new wife? How many children are there and do you all feel this way? Is dad originally from this country?
Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 01:07 pm Post Subject:
I must agree with Gary on this one, if this situation actually exists, it is very sad.
But if it was just a made up thing, it's just sick!
Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 01:12 pm Post Subject:
And I agree with Ins. maze. It really is sad if someone cares more about money over a persons health. Sometimes when I hear stories like this it makes me wonder how greed overcame the human soul (and heart).
Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 03:10 pm Post Subject:
It is always good to exchange views so that we can see things from broader perspective.
When referring to Florida Statute 732.802, it states that "......(1) A surviving person who unlawfully and intentionally kills or participates in procuring the death of the decedent is not entitled to any benefits....and the estate of the decedent passes as if the killer had predeceased the decedent.....and (3) A named beneficiary of .... life insurance policy...who unlawfully and intentionally kills ..... the person upon whose life the policy is issued is not entitled to any benefit under the ... policy.....; and it becomes payable as though the killer had predeceased the decedent....."
It is clear that if the murderer is a named beneficiary of the policy and if he kills the insured, he will not be entitled to the estates of the deceased.
With reference to what "hurt" describes, it appears that the father is the policyholder and not the named beneficiary of the policies.
I am not sure if Florida Statute 732.802 is applicable to situation where the murderer is the policyholder and not the named beneficiary.
Add your comment